Author Topic: The Blue Pack Mystery  (Read 4288 times)

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Offline Paul_Maul

  • Posts: 3333
The Blue Pack Mystery
« on: October 17, 2010, 07:05:50 PM »
Even if you are not consumed by unopened packs the way I am, this mystery is still intriguing.

Define an unopened pack to be a combination of a series and a wrapper. So for example, one unopened pack is the 9th series pack with the 85-fold green ID Bracelet wrapper.

The blue packs are the first packs to present mysteries, because there are 4 possible packs for each series using the blue wrapper, the 21 or 85 fold, and the presence or lack of the wall poster ad. Not every one of these possible packs exists.

Here is how the 4 blue wrappers occur for each series from 5 through 8:

The 21-fold wrapper with no ad was used for series 5 and 6. I don't believe it was used after that (although there are many GAI graded packs with this wrapper that are misidentified as 7ths though they are really 6ths).

The 21-fold wrapper with the wall poster ad was used for series 6 and 7, and no other series.

The 85-fold wrapper with no ad was used for series 5, 6 and 7.

Here's the interesting part: the 85-fold wrapper with the wall poster ad was used for series 5,6 and 8 (the only blue wrapper used for the 8th series)  for sure. Looking at the above, it seems logical that it would have also been used for the 7th series.
Yet, notwithstanding a scan on Greg's page that may or may not be a legitimate pack, I have never seen such a pack after looking for over 5 years.

The wildcard in all this is the 7th gumless packs, which are also 85-fold. I believe the 85-fold and 21-fold packs were produced at different facilities, using different machines. Is it possible that the production of the gumless packs somehow replaced the similar packs with the wall poster ad? That might also explain why there were leftover wrappers of this type to use for 8th series packs.

The sad part is we will probably never know. I sure would love to know whether or not the 85-fold 7th series pack with wall poster ad really exists.

Offline bandaches

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Re: The Blue Pack Mystery
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2010, 09:59:33 PM »
Even if you are not consumed by unopened packs the way I am, this mystery is still intriguing.

Define an unopened pack to be a combination of a series and a wrapper. So for example, one unopened pack is the 9th series pack with the 85-fold green ID Bracelet wrapper.

The blue packs are the first packs to present mysteries, because there are 4 possible packs for each series using the blue wrapper, the 21 or 85 fold, and the presence or lack of the wall poster ad. Not every one of these possible packs exists.

Here is how the 4 blue wrappers occur for each series from 5 through 8:

The 21-fold wrapper with no ad was used for series 5 and 6. I don't believe it was used after that (although there are many GAI graded packs with this wrapper that are misidentified as 7ths though they are really 6ths).

The 21-fold wrapper with the wall poster ad was used for series 6 and 7, and no other series.

The 85-fold wrapper with no ad was used for series 5, 6 and 7.

Here's the interesting part: the 85-fold wrapper with the wall poster ad was used for series 5,6 and 8 (the only blue wrapper used for the 8th series)  for sure. Looking at the above, it seems logical that it would have also been used for the 7th series.
Yet, notwithstanding a scan on Greg's page that may or may not be a legitimate pack, I have never seen such a pack after looking for over 5 years.

The wildcard in all this is the 7th gumless packs, which are also 85-fold. I believe the 85-fold and 21-fold packs were produced at different facilities, using different machines. Is it possible that the production of the gumless packs somehow replaced the similar packs with the wall poster ad? That might also explain why there were leftover wrappers of this type to use for 8th series packs.

The sad part is we will probably never know. I sure would love to know whether or not the 85-fold 7th series pack with wall poster ad really exists.

Would this help us figure out which 7th packs had Grime Heavy?  Those definitely seemed to be regionally released.  One collection I bought from Minnesota had 20 Grime Heavies and zero Grime Dusties.  Somehow I thought we determined gumless packs do NOT contain Grime Heavy but I can't recall how we came up with that conclusion.
Contact me at bandaches@yahoo.com as I have tons of wackys for sale!  Visit my website http://www.wackypackage.com/

Offline Paul_Maul

  • Posts: 3333
Re: The Blue Pack Mystery
« Reply #2 on: October 20, 2010, 11:20:46 AM »
There are three types of 7th series packs: the 21-fold with wall poster ad (which you have a bunch of - common, though usually in rough shape), the 85-fold with no ad (I have several extras of these, they're pretty common), and the gumless (ultra common). I see nothing that makes any of these more or less likely to have a Grime Heavy. The only possible correlation could be showing that one type of pack was used later in the run. But both ad types were used in the 6th series too, so I see no reason to think any of these three pack types predates or postdates the others.

As for regional correlation, it is possible that the "Heavy" replacement was never made in some parts of the country (if it occurred very late in the run). So those areas would have no Heavys.

 

Offline sunsweat

  • Posts: 68
Re: The Blue Pack Mystery
« Reply #3 on: October 20, 2010, 08:05:08 PM »
There are three types of 7th series packs: the 21-fold with wall poster ad (which you have a bunch of - common, though usually in rough shape), the 85-fold with no ad (I have several extras of these, they're pretty common), and the gumless (ultra common). I see nothing that makes any of these more or less likely to have a Grime Heavy. The only possible correlation could be showing that one type of pack was used later in the run. But both ad types were used in the 6th series too, so I see no reason to think any of these three pack types predates or postdates the others.

As for regional correlation, it is possible that the "Heavy" replacement was never made in some parts of the country (if it occurred very late in the run). So those areas would have no Heavys.

 

I pulled a Grime Heavy from a gumless pack.

Offline Paul_Maul

  • Posts: 3333
Re: The Blue Pack Mystery
« Reply #4 on: November 24, 2010, 01:00:07 PM »
This mystery almost just got a whole lot more interesting. This auction is currently on ebay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Wacky-Packages-16-Unopened-Wax-Pack-Series-15-box-/320621573220?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4aa688f464

From the picture and the description, we have a 5th series box and a bunch of 21-fold blue packs with the wall poster ad.
5th series packs like this are one of the varieties I do not believe exist. Sure enough, when the seller checked to see what was
showing on the back of one of the packs, they turn out to be 6th series. Oh well, maybe next time...   :-[

Wonder why they turned up with a 5th series box??

Offline BustedFinger

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Re: The Blue Pack Mystery
« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2010, 05:16:36 PM »
Did the seller explain why he thought they were 15th series packs?
Giving "The Hobby" the finger since 1999!

Offline bigtomi

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Re: The Blue Pack Mystery
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2010, 05:39:46 PM »
Did the seller explain why he thought they were 15th series packs?
No, someone "told him" they were series 15s. Probably GAI.  LOL

BTW, that was me that asked the seller to check the code/contents for verification. No way they coulda been 15th series with a poster ad...