Author Topic: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation  (Read 551 times)

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462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« on: August 10, 2019, 08:44:48 AM »
We haven't had any original series discussions in quite a while - so here's something to talk about

While sorting through some old blue wrappers the other day, I again recalled a vivid memory of ripping open packs of 6th and 7th as a kid and wondering about a white triangular spot in the K on some of the packs.

I mentioned this on the other forum a long time ago, but I had no pictures to show what I was talking about. So, at the time it was dismissed as probably nothing more than poor quality control at Topps, and akin to the dust rings in the black borders. (i.e. nothing special)

Somewhere in the years since that post I picked up several of these 'special K' wrappers without realizing it. Looking at them recently with fresh eyes, I now believe that these are true variations, and not just bad QC.

Two things really stand out with these wrappers:  the first is that white triangle in the K in Wacky. The second is that the colors are saturated, with heavily printed ink, and using a deeper shade of blue than the other 462-21-01's.

To me, the clincher of what makes this is a variation though, is that these wrappers have a second black guide line located at the lower left. No other Wacky wrapper that I've seen has that second black bar (time for everyone to dig through their wrapper piles looking for guide marks!). And for the most part, Topps never uses a second bar on their wrappers. (I've found two exceptions out of the scores of wrappers across the decades that I've looked through. And for both titles, all the wrappers that I found have two bars, which would indicate they're meant to be there).

The entire image on the wrapper is also shifted right, to provide room for the black bar. I don't believe this is the result of a mis-cut, but intentional. I haven't seen many packs though, but it's possible that the folds of the wrapper are also offset to the right in order to keep the image centered. I'll leave that for the pack aficionados to figure out.

Whether any of this is enough for folks to want to have an example in their collection, I'd be curious to hear.



For fun I looked at Greg's site to see what images he has posted. His pic of the unfolded 462-21-01 is the pale blue variety, while his pics for the 6th and 7th series packs are the white triangle variety.
http://www.wackypacks.com/wrappers/0-462-21-01-3_small.html
http://www.wackypackages.org/packs/6th_packs.html
http://www.wackypackages.org/packs/7th_packs.html

The white triangle in the K. Colors and contrast exaggerated to make it stand out.


Side by side of two 462-21-01 wrappers, to show color and saturation differences


highlighting the unique points of the variation wrapper

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2019, 10:38:21 AM »
Shade differences in wrappers of the same basic color occur for several of the wrapper colors. Definitely yellow, blue and green.

I donít have enough wrappers to look into the guide lines, but I donít think the white triangle wrappers are the only ones of this shade of blue. I think some 7th series wrappers without the triangle have the same shade.

Do these two appear to be the same shade to you? One seems to have deeper yellow lettering, but the blues look the same to me.

« Last Edit: August 10, 2019, 10:43:06 AM by Paul_Maul »

Offline MoldRush

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2019, 11:17:49 AM »
I would say the triangle and darker color are better described as indicators of a variation, indicative of a separate print run, whereas the added black bar pushes it into legit variation territory.

Iíve noticed a similar color distinction in the green wrappers, a very light, almost pastel-like shade, and a much darker one. Wouldnít be surprised if there were other small differences like what we have here, that are easily overlooked until closely examined.

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2019, 11:27:32 AM »
I would say the triangle and darker color are better described as indicators of a variation, indicative of a separate print run, whereas the added black bar pushes it into legit variation territory.

Iíve noticed a similar color distinction in the green wrappers, a very light, almost pastel-like shade, and a much darker one. Wouldnít be surprised if there were other small differences like what we have here, that are easily overlooked until closely examined.

Yes, if I recall correctly, the 85 fold wrappers from series 9 and the 21 fold ones from series 11 seem to be the darker shade of green. All the others including all 12ths are the lighter shade of green.

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2019, 11:35:04 AM »
Here are packs I view as the darker shade of green....21-fold 11th and 85-fold 9th...





...and here are ones that I view as the lighter shade....21-fold 9ths, 85-fold 11ths, and all 12ths....







Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2019, 11:37:30 AM »
I never noticed it before, but the 21-fold 9th on the bottom above has the Tied box as red as the Quacker, which the others do not....

Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2019, 01:10:19 PM »
Shade differences in wrappers of the same basic color occur for several of the wrapper colors. Definitely yellow, blue and green.

I donít have enough wrappers to look into the guide lines, but I donít think the white triangle wrappers are the only ones of this shade of blue. I think some 7th series wrappers without the triangle have the same shade.

Do these two appear to be the same shade to you? One seems to have deeper yellow lettering, but the blues look the same to me.

fantastic that you have a pack with the triangle. Was that intentional or just part of your mix of packs?

I agree, shade differences do appear for the same wrapper colors across a series, and some of the other 462 production codes do have a darker blue as well. Just looking at Greg's page showing the 4-5 packs of 6th and 7th, those different hues are visible. (But the 462 triangle packs strongly stand out even there).

From what I see on my monitor, your pack on the left does have a darker shade of blue (along with the deeper yellow). I assume the one on the right is also a 21-01?
I have a couple dozen regular 21-01 wrappers and while a majority are that pale blue, some are darker, but still not as deep a blue as the triangle version.
These middle series wrappers likely had the highest productions runs of any of them, so chances of color differences for a specific wrapper code are also probably pretty great. And if it's just tone difference, no big deal, but having the defective K, and the extra guide bar is enough to put it in variation territory for me.

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2019, 01:20:13 PM »
I actually had an entire full 6th series box of the white triangle packs. Once I stopped collecting full boxes I kept one and sold off the others gradually over the years.


Offline RawGoo

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2019, 01:32:39 PM »
I actually had an entire full 6th series box of the white triangle packs. Once I stopped collecting full boxes I kept one and sold off the others gradually over the years.

Wow, a full box of OS!!  I count myself fortunate to even have my empty Series 15 box as an example.  How many different full original series boxes did you have?

I just checked and my 6th pack is the regular kind.

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2019, 01:43:12 PM »
Wow, a full box of OS!!  I count myself fortunate to even have my empty Series 15 box as an example.  How many different full original series boxes did you have?

I just checked and my 6th pack is the regular kind.

At one point I had the following full boxes:

2nd Series
3rd Series
6th Series
7th Series
7th Gumless
9th Series
10th Series
12th Series
14th Series
15th Series

Eventually, I opened all the 15th series packs, thatís where most of my PSA 15th set came from.  I sold the 3rd box to Greg Schwartz. I sold a lot of the packs to Greg while keeping the display boxes because they were all in nice shape. He put the packs in lesser display boxes and sold them. I think the 6ths were the only series where I kept all the packs and sold them gradually.

Offline RawGoo

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2019, 01:55:34 PM »
That must have been a sight to behold!

Now I have to decide whether I want a 6th pack with the white triangle........

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #11 on: August 10, 2019, 02:03:14 PM »
That must have been a sight to behold!

Now I have to decide whether I want a 6th pack with the white triangle........

That is the only 21-fold 6th series no ad pack I own. I never really viewed it as a variation. I donít think I ever even took notice of it until Patrick pointed it out years ago.

Offline NationalSpittoon

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #12 on: August 11, 2019, 04:34:51 AM »
I looked through all my packs and wrappers and donít have any of the triangle prints.

I did just look through my lack luster reissue collection, though, and I found a neat error.



Just a misprint, but adds a new dimension to the Wacky Packs logo on the checklist.

Offline MadMike

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #13 on: August 12, 2019, 11:52:12 PM »
I donít get it. Where is the misprint?

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #14 on: August 13, 2019, 06:41:38 AM »
Heís talking about the fact that the salmon ink was applied slightly to the right, giving the lettering a 3-D appearance.

Offline MadMike

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #15 on: August 13, 2019, 09:34:10 PM »
I see that now. Thank you!

Offline All-Brain

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #16 on: August 14, 2019, 05:26:41 PM »
I looked through all my packs and wrappers and donít have any of the triangle prints.

I did just look through my lack luster reissue collection, though, and I found a neat error.



Just a misprint, but adds a new dimension to the Wacky Packs logo on the checklist.
Hey Mr! No Reissue is "Lack Luster!!" :)

Offline NationalSpittoon

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #17 on: August 15, 2019, 04:23:51 AM »
Hey Mr! No Reissue is "Lack Luster!!" :)

I never said the reissues were lack luster, I said my collection is.  ;)

Offline RawGoo

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #18 on: August 15, 2019, 04:50:16 AM »
I never said the reissues were lack luster, I said my collection is.  ;)

I think Jeff was saying that whatever you have is cool, not lack luster  ;)

Offline NationalSpittoon

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #19 on: August 15, 2019, 08:16:43 AM »
I think Jeff was saying that whatever you have is cool, not lack luster  ;)

I know. I was making a joke that didnít make sense whatsoever.

Offline RawGoo

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #20 on: August 15, 2019, 01:05:18 PM »
I know. I was making a joke that didnít make sense whatsoever.

If you can use some lackluster reissue stickers, PM me.

Offline All-Brain

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #21 on: August 15, 2019, 06:29:12 PM »
Pat, don't make me fly out there and...Ö.. and...ÖÖÖ.oh never mind :)

Offline RawGoo

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Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #22 on: August 16, 2019, 12:31:11 AM »
Pat, don't make me fly out there and...Ö.. and...ÖÖÖ.oh never mind :)

Consider yourself tweaked  >:D

Seriously though, I do have plenty of mid-grade reissue stickers if anyone is trying to complete sets.

Re: 462-21-01 white triangle wrapper variation
« Reply #23 on: September 03, 2019, 03:58:59 PM »
well, this kind of wandered around for a bit, but back to the wrapper.

Using a reprint as an example (for continuity with all the reprint lovers on this thread), an image of the proof also shows that the wrappers are by design to have just the single black bar at the upper right.
With this variation, it's not the color, or even so much the white triangle (although I've not seen other wrappers with such printing defects), but having the two black bars that set this one apart from the others.