Author Topic: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?  (Read 26473 times)

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Offline DrDeal

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Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« on: May 16, 2015, 05:35:53 PM »
Now that Mars Attacks Occupation is off to a great start on Kickstarter; I wonder how much support Wacky Packages Old School Series 6 would receive if it were a Kickstarter Campaign?  I have pledged on the Mars Attacks Campaign and just checked to see what the basic numbers are.

292 Backers have pledged $102K so far.   

If we needed to hit $50K to make OS6 happen (As Mars Attacks did)  that works out to $166 from 300 people.

Maybe sell the Basic Master set with Binder for $100 and sell sketch packs as add-on's hoping people would spend another $60 on add -ons.

That's what I pledged for Mars Attacks: $100 for the Basic Master and $70 for two sketch packs that have either a sketch or a metal card plus some other cards and you are assured to get both a metal and a sketch if you buy two packs.

The add-ons could entice people to spend much more if they offered original art and other cool items. Maybe we could hit 100K or above?

We could use this thread to demonstrate support or lack of interest in this type of offering. Either way; lets discuss.

Regards,  Andrew


Offline dth1971

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2015, 08:34:50 PM »
Now that Mars Attacks Occupation is off to a great start on Kickstarter; I wonder how much support Wacky Packages Old School Series 6 would receive if it were a Kickstarter Campaign?  I have pledged on the Mars Attacks Campaign and just checked to see what the basic numbers are.

292 Backers have pledged $102K so far.   

If we needed to hit $50K to make OS6 happen (As Mars Attacks did)  that works out to $166 from 300 people.

Maybe sell the Basic Master set with Binder for $100 and sell sketch packs as add-on's hoping people would spend another $60 on add -ons.

That's what I pledged for Mars Attacks: $100 for the Basic Master and $70 for two sketch packs that have either a sketch or a metal card plus some other cards and you are assured to get both a metal and a sketch if you buy two packs.

The add-ons could entice people to spend much more if they offered original art and other cool items. Maybe we could hit 100K or above?

We could use this thread to demonstrate support or lack of interest in this type of offering. Either way; lets discuss.

Regards,  Andrew

Go for it, Andrew! An Old School Series 6 Wacky Packages set Kickstarter campaign would be great, it could even include besides the base OS6 1970's era stickers two subsets of Wacky Packages Old School 1980's and Wacky Packages Old School 1990's entries. Even a sticker subset of lost 1970's Wackies that never made the 1970's original sticker series (But turned up later in the 2 Wacky Pack Flashback series in the Lost Wackys subset) in tan, white, ludlow, and die cut sticker back forms would be fine for Old School 6.

Offline lucidjc

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2015, 11:45:03 PM »
I don't think I would support it. I mean with the M.A. it is a pretty fresh idea, (not a lot of card time). Wackys on the other hand are beat to death. With OS 5 being $15 a box, there may not be a lot of interest in spending lots on more (or less).

Offline ratchet007

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2015, 04:31:23 AM »
 I would have to know what I was getting for the money before I would 100% commit to supporting this. I  will add that Old School is the only thing that has kept my interest in any new Wacky Package release since ANS7. I am so fed up with different color borders and alternate art and alternate backs and all the other CRAP Topps has come up with in the recent past as a means to try to suck more money out of my pocket that I could scream. Old School is still a favorite of mine and I sincerely hope they keep new releases coming.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2015, 07:02:03 AM by ratchet007 »

Offline DrDeal

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #4 on: May 17, 2015, 05:00:40 AM »
Someone else posted on the MA KS page that they would like it if a WP KS campaign was done. I chimed in over there and asked Al Levine from Topps to see if he could float the idea to someone at Topps who could make it happen. Time will tell. I agree MA is "fresher" and less overdone than WP but OS is kind in a WP 'league of its own" and is not a "retread" .

Offline quas

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #5 on: May 17, 2015, 05:24:46 AM »
I don't think I would support it. I mean with the M.A. it is a pretty fresh idea, (not a lot of card time). Wackys on the other hand are beat to death. With OS 5 being $15 a box, there may not be a lot of interest in spending lots on more (or less).

I would not pay additional $$ to support what for me is an addiction.  Sorry to be a contrarian, but I need to "train" myself to enjoy the Wackies I have instead of always looking forward to the next series, the next unopened pack, the next unopened box.  Would rather have the successive Wacky series spread further apart in time as well. 
Marc

Offline dth1971

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #6 on: May 17, 2015, 06:20:41 AM »
I don't think I would support it. I mean with the M.A. it is a pretty fresh idea, (not a lot of card time). Wackys on the other hand are beat to death. With OS 5 being $15 a box, there may not be a lot of interest in spending lots on more (or less).

Did Topps support last year a Star Wars Wacky Packages edition that never came to be, not even on Kickstarter?

Offline DrDeal

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #7 on: May 17, 2015, 08:06:13 AM »
Did Topps support last year a Star Wars Wacky Packages edition that never came to be, not even on Kickstarter?

I read that Star Wars Wackies cancellation were more about lack of Lucasfilm's support than fan support.

I understand the logic of not always wanting more; but I like the idea of having current artists continue what was so fun for me as a kid. I will always support that.

OS is a tribute. There is reverence, respect , fandom and many other concepts at play with OS.

Offline quas

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #8 on: May 17, 2015, 08:52:08 AM »
I read that Star Wars Wackies cancellation were more about lack of Lucasfilm's support than fan support.

I understand the logic of not always wanting more; but I like the idea of having current artists continue what was so fun for me as a kid. I will always support that.

OS is a tribute. There is reverence, respect , fandom and many other concepts at play with OS.

I wonder if it would be possible to have a Wacky issue titled "Tribute to Norm" as a tribute to Norm Saunders.  I realize of course that every Wacky issue featuring Original Series 1-16 is a tribute to Norm, but perhaps Topps could come up with something.
Marc

Offline DrDeal

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #9 on: May 17, 2015, 10:46:42 AM »
I would have to know what I was getting for the money before I would 100% commit to supporting this. I  will add that Old School is the only thing that has kept my interest in any new Wacky Package release since ANS7. I am so fed up with different color borders and alternate art and alternate backs and all the other CRAP Topps has come up with in the recent past as a means to try to suck more money out of my pocket that I could scream. Old School is still a favorite of mine and I sincerely hope they keep new releases coming.

Maybe we could have Dave Gross get our ideas and through some back and forth on this site and develop the basic ideas which could form the pledge levels for OS 6 on KS. Ideas for extras could be floated and discussed. Then the set would end up as a consensus of what people wanted from things were posited as possibilities by Dave or another Topps contact.

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #10 on: May 17, 2015, 10:50:27 AM »
I wonder if it would be possible to have a Wacky issue titled "Tribute to Norm" as a tribute to Norm Saunders.  I realize of course that every Wacky issue featuring Original Series 1-16 is a tribute to Norm, but perhaps Topps could come up with something.

Wright would have to spearhead that, his mastery of green eyelids is unparalleled!

Offline lucidjc

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #11 on: May 17, 2015, 12:15:36 PM »
It was the extra crap that really turned me away from wackys. All kickstarter is going to do is add more extra crap. And honestly, that's the last thing I want to see.  But hey that's just me, I'm sure you are all different. We really have to look at the horse, its near death and we still keep beating it.


Topps = to much to fast

Offline DrDeal

  • Posts: 3414
Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #12 on: May 17, 2015, 12:23:46 PM »
It was the extra crap that really turned me away from wackys. All kickstarter is going to do is add more extra crap. And honestly, that's the last thing I want to see.  But hey that's just me, I'm sure you are all different. We really have to look at the horse, its near death and we still keep beating it.


Topps = to much to fast

I view it as a plant that I keep watering because I don't want it to die.   If buying some extra crap on KS helps keep the plant alive ...... then that works for me. 

Offline ratchet007

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #13 on: May 17, 2015, 12:28:22 PM »
Maybe we could have Dave Gross get our ideas and through some back and forth on this site and develop the basic ideas which could form the pledge levels for OS 6 on KS. Ideas for extras could be floated and discussed. Then the set would end up as a consensus of what people wanted from things were posited as possibilities by Dave or another Topps contact.

We're not even sure of the status of Old School 6 at this time. It may be released without the need for a Kickstarter program. Which, I might add, is what I would prefer. Let's not get ahead of ourselves here Doc. You're already talking as if it's a done deal.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2015, 01:04:16 PM by ratchet007 »

Offline RawGoo

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #14 on: May 17, 2015, 12:34:17 PM »
I view it as a plant that I keep watering because I don't want it to die.   If buying some extra crap on KS helps keep the plant alive ...... then that works for me.

I also want to keep the brand going.  But, I am still hoping that Topps will produce OS6 themselves.  I already buy more than I need to support sales, and I have to look into this whole Kickstarter thing before I decide whether to spend money there, too.

Offline DrDeal

  • Posts: 3414
Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #15 on: May 17, 2015, 02:15:38 PM »
We're not even sure of the status of Old School 6 at this time. It may be released without the need for a Kickstarter program. Which, I might add, is what I would prefer. Let's not get ahead of ourselves here Doc. You're already talking as if it's a done deal.

I too would prefer a traditional release for OS 6.  I don't see how it can hurt to discuss what level of interest there would be from this board for a WP KS program if that ever occurred.  Its all conjecture and if OS was in peril; a thread like this could save it.  I don't see how this discussion could hurt OS 6's chances of seeing the light of day. It could spur some Topps commentary on what the future of OS and Wackies in general are.

Offline bigtomi

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #16 on: May 17, 2015, 03:37:41 PM »
I view it as a plant that I keep watering because I don't want it to die.
So, drown it instead of beating it to death?  :P

Offline vahsurfer

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #17 on: May 17, 2015, 03:54:37 PM »
I know you are probably tired of me beating the dead horse.... instead of new stuff first how about binders for:

Chrome
2014 Series 1
2015 Series 2

Incomplete without an official binder, yet they continue to make them for GPK!?!?!?

Offline DrDeal

  • Posts: 3414
Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #18 on: May 17, 2015, 03:57:04 PM »
So, drown it instead of beating it to death?  :P

How to kill Wacky Packages? I know how to kill packs. Not the actual brand. I don't have the stomach for it.

Offline sco(o)t

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #19 on: May 17, 2015, 04:26:37 PM »
I know you are probably tired of me beating the dead horse.... instead of new stuff first how about binders for:

Chrome
2014 Series 1
2015 Series 2

Incomplete without an official binder, yet they continue to make them for GPK!?!?!?

I viewed the release of 16 binders for GPK about a year or so ago as kind of catching up to WP after the Series 1 through 16 binders. Although the GPK binders were are not labelled for any particular set or series, they have not really released any new ones specifically for the past GPK series.
aka Scot Leibacher (no trademark)

Offline sco(o)t

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #20 on: May 17, 2015, 04:35:21 PM »
I also want to keep the brand going.  But, I am still hoping that Topps will produce OS6 themselves.  I already buy more than I need to support sales, and I have to look into this whole Kickstarter thing before I decide whether to spend money there, too.

I can understand many of the quick start programs where someone has a good idea to venture into a new area, etc. but doesn't it seems weird to anyone else that a company that produces trading cards would need a quick start to produce a trading card set? Isn't marketing research for established companies supposed to guarantee there is demand for a given item? What next, Ford will only release a new model car after a quick start program guarantees so many sales? Just not quite sure I feel this is what quick starts were really intended for. Seems like laziness on some level, in this case.
aka Scot Leibacher (no trademark)

Offline dth1971

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #21 on: May 17, 2015, 07:45:43 PM »
How about Kickstarter Wacky Packages campaigns for:
* THE LOST WACKY PACK ENTRIES
* A BEHIND THE WACKY PACK SERIES WITH SELECTED WACKY PACKAGES ENTRIES FROM THE PAST NEARLY GOING ON 50 YEARS WITH LINER NOTES ON THE BACK.

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #22 on: May 18, 2015, 03:30:09 AM »
I can understand many of the quick start programs where someone has a good idea to venture into a new area, etc. but doesn't it seems weird to anyone else that a company that produces trading cards would need a quick start to produce a trading card set? Isn't marketing research for established companies supposed to guarantee there is demand for a given item? What next, Ford will only release a new model car after a quick start program guarantees so many sales? Just not quite sure I feel this is what quick starts were really intended for. Seems like laziness on some level, in this case.

Exactly. I think it's ridiculous, but it mitigates risk for them I guess, so they love it.

Offline quas

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #23 on: May 18, 2015, 04:54:32 AM »
Exactly. I think it's ridiculous, but it mitigates risk for them I guess, so they love it.

I don't suppose that if they do very well on the series, they distribute any of the excess back to the "venture capitalists."
Marc

Offline JasonLiebig

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #24 on: May 18, 2015, 09:22:33 AM »
Exactly. I think it's ridiculous, but it mitigates risk for them I guess, so they love it.

There have been many discussions on this, both for and against, with regard to well-established (and well-funded) companies utilizing Kickstarter and other similar crowd-funding sites.  It came up alot after the Veronica Mars movie was funded for $8 million.  Warner Brothers owns Veronica Mars, but they weren't going to make the movie until the creator and others involved challenged them to do it if a Kickstarter could raise the $2 million needed to shoot.  And rabid fans of the television show made sure it got that on day one.  I suspect Warner was a bit shocked by that (as was nearly everyone else). 

So, the positives are that fans supported something they wanted but had previously been unable to get, and because of that, they got it.  The negative side take is basically this; "Really Warner Brothers?  You're having fans pay for production?"  And Kickstarter "rewards" aren't allowed to be percentages of profits, as a standard investor would get.  So, I think this is still bold new territory that is being tread upon. 

I'm mostly on the positive side in these instances.    I feel Kickstarter and other crowd-funding should typically be used for people like me, who might have good ideas that they want to bring to life and that could gather support, but don't have the financial resources to bring them together to produce on their own.   I love the idea that crowdfunding brings resources to independent creators and entrepreneurs.  It's exciting. 

Even so, if the method occassionally serves as some kind of pre-order for larger companies to, as Dave points out, mitigate risk, I don't necessarily see the harm.  Especially if it doesn't damage the ability for folks like myself to utilize the same methods. 
« Last Edit: May 18, 2015, 09:24:28 AM by JasonLiebig »
Jason Liebig - A swell TV host (currently on History Channel) who used to oversee Marvel Comics' X-Men - now creator and curator of WishbookWeb.com and CollectingCandy.com, a celebration of candy packaging, marketing and the people behind it all

Offline quas

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #25 on: May 18, 2015, 09:31:04 AM »
There have been many discussions on this, both for and against, with regard to well-established (and well-funded) companies utilizing Kickstarter and other similar crowd-funding sites.  It came up alot after the Veronica Mars movie was funded for $8 million.  Warner Brothers owns Veronica Mars, but they weren't going to make the movie until the creator and others involved challenged them to do it if a Kickstarter could raise the $2 million needed to shoot.  And rabid fans of the television show made sure it got that on day one.  I suspect Warner was a bit shocked by that (as was nearly everyone else). 

So, the positives are that fans supported something they wanted but had previously been unable to get, and because of that, they got it.  The negative side take is basically this; "Really Warner Brothers?  You're having fans pay for production?"  And Kickstarter "rewards" aren't allowed to be percentages of profits, as a standard investor would get.  So, I think this is still bold new territory that is being tread upon. 

I'm mostly on the positive side in these instances.    I feel Kickstarter and other crowd-funding should typically be used for people like me, who might have good ideas that they want to bring to life and that could gather support, but don't have the financial resources to bring them together to produce on their own.   I love the idea that crowdfunding brings resources to independent creators and entrepreneurs.  It's exciting. 

Even so, if the method occassionally serves as some kind of pre-order for larger companies to, as Dave points out, mitigate risk, I don't necessarily see the harm.  Especially if it doesn't damage the ability for folks like myself to utilize the same methods.

Hey, as long as all donors are willing donors, and accept the fact that many non-donors will benefit from the donors' donations and efforts, I don't necessarily see the harm either.
Marc

Offline slamjim

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #26 on: May 18, 2015, 12:44:57 PM »
Still waiting to hear about OS6. It's not dead, just being talked about still. Just in case I did write up a good Kickstarter proposal and sent that to them a few weeks ago. I think it was really tight with lots of good ideas and I didn't mention colored borders and back types at all! Don't know yet what route they will take or none at all.

Offline RawGoo

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #27 on: May 18, 2015, 01:28:10 PM »
Still waiting to hear about OS6. It's not dead, just being talked about still. Just in case I did write up a good Kickstarter proposal and sent that to them a few weeks ago. I think it was really tight with lots of good ideas and I didn't mention colored borders and back types at all! Don't know yet what route they will take or none at all.

I am still holding out hope for Old School 6!!  Please keep us posted.  Those and the postcards are my favorites, and if Topps stops the really good stuff, I may just stop spending my money on their new products.

Offline WPcollector

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #28 on: May 19, 2015, 05:23:58 AM »
I think card sets should continue to be released in a traditional manner. Otherwise we'll be paying 40$ for base sets soon.

Offline Hustler08

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #29 on: May 19, 2015, 08:30:47 AM »
Still waiting to hear about OS6. It's not dead, just being talked about still. Just in case I did write up a good Kickstarter proposal and sent that to them a few weeks ago. I think it was really tight with lots of good ideas and I didn't mention colored borders and back types at all! Don't know yet what route they will take or none at all.

But did you mention ALL Colored Sketches like the ones in MARS?? Love that!!  :] :] :]

Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #30 on: May 19, 2015, 02:15:03 PM »
I think a 10-15 year hiatus for wackys would be good. Good for the addicts and good for the hobby. I never thought I'd say that but..I guess I just did. A George Wright involvement is a game changer tho, especially if he were to do the whole series, with Jay involved as much as possible. Those are the only two factors that would entice me at this point to buy any more OLDS for more than $14.99 a box. Not having bought any ANS since 5, and not crazy about half the titles, consistently, in each OLDS that's where I'm at these days. Darynne

Offline Joe G.

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #31 on: May 20, 2015, 10:59:13 AM »
Exactly. I think it's ridiculous, but it mitigates risk for them I guess, so they love it.

Dave, I don't think this is the case at all.  From what I've read Topps was close to abandoning Mars Attacks and it became a labor of love for Adam Levine to work with the fans to keep it alive.  Let's be realistic at $100K nobody is making a fortune on this.  After printing and shipping costs and paying employees I can't imagine the amount of profit is that significant.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2015, 01:52:11 PM by Joe G. »

Offline Hustler08

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #32 on: May 20, 2015, 12:25:54 PM »
Dave, I don't think this is the case at all.  From what I've read Topps was close to abandoning Mars Attacks and it became a labor of love for Adam Lavine to work with the fans to keep it alive.  Let's be realistic at $100K nobody is making a fortune on this.  After printing and shipping costs and paying employees I can't imagine the amount of profit is that significant.

Well said Joe - but it is a great deal for the collectors...I am not even a fan but I am a kickstarter on this project!! esp. getting the Wacky Pack Mashup!! I will offer some of my items for sale here for any collectors who can't get in on the proj $$$  :-[ :-[

Offline Jean Nutty

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #33 on: May 20, 2015, 12:33:05 PM »
Levine, at Topps, has these and other comments about the subject over on Blowout, regarding Mars Attacks

"That's the big thing: quality. By utilizing Kickstarter, we've been allowed to go outside of our normal production process. Which is going to allow us to be a lot more flexible. It's going to mean a lot more work for me, but in the end, hopefully a better product will be the result, and you guys will be the beneficiaries of it. But yes, customizing your purchase, being able to get exactly what you want. You'll be able to buy by the box, but also bundles of items, master sets, etc. I see it as a big opportunity, and an advantage of going through Kickstarter... because also don't have their red tape. I can give our sketch artists a lot more time, I don't have to nail down a product configuration as soon, giving me more flexibility to make changes based on what's working, what's not and most importantly, how fans are responding on Kickstarter. Definitely looking at higher quality sketches-- fewer sketches per artist, or at worst MUCH LONGER deadlines (and that's something that Kickstarter allows us, for a change)."

http://www.blowoutcards.com/forums/non-sports/849349-mars-attacks-occupation-kickstarter-may-5th.html
« Last Edit: May 20, 2015, 02:37:47 PM by Jean Nutty »

Offline ElectricSlave

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Re: Would You Support Old School 6 on Kickstarter?
« Reply #34 on: May 20, 2015, 02:14:42 PM »
I took a peek at Kickstarter, but I'm not good on web surfing and either get annoyed or lost or my eyes glaze over. If it's not a investment you get a return on...what is it? I can't imagine just giving my money away supporting some faddish unimportant thing. OH sure wackies for example would be fun, but If you're just giving the money away wouldn't you be better off supporting E.R.D.O. Growing Projects or something that helps people? what am I missing? I gleaned that there were choices of 'return', not sure what they were ...was already going numb...eyes so heavy....
Maybe use me as an example. Say I wanted to make these wackies of mine a real pro sticker set. what would you do? your options, and what would be expected of me? How would I make your investment...if it can be called... that worth your while?...make you want to throw money at it? Why are big time operators like Topps using this? It seems to me it would be for those struggling to make a go of it...not those already too to need help. Seems like it should be more closely similar to say Dragons Den.