Author Topic: Original series sticker variations  (Read 4407 times)

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Offline Kook

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Original series sticker variations
« on: May 15, 2013, 06:27:53 PM »
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1975-Topps-Wacky-Packages-14th-Series-Complete-30-Card-Set-EX-NM-Variation-s-/190835036655?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT&nma=true&si=a4baozf8zPIdnw8H7g3DzfoQYhE%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc#ht_78wt_1399

This auction got me thinking about 2 questions:
1. Are the 2 variations the seller talks about legitimate variations or just a printing anomoly like running low on ink or something - rotsa root 14th series dark green letters vs. black letters & 14th noose-x blue box vs purple box. I can't even tell a difference from the pics...

2. Is there a page on Rusty's or Greg's site, or somewhere else that lists all 1st to 16th variations in stickers & puzzle pieces? If not, I'll start with a few, and if anyone else knows of any, please chime in.

1. 1st series Maddie Boy & Oddie Boy - Oddie boy has no blue shading in various parts of the sticker
2. 5th series Cram has 2 diecut variations
3. 8th series Kleenaxe has a variation with and without a hash mark above the axe. I believe they correspond to one asterisk copyright & 2 asterisk copyright stickers.

Offline Porkie

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2013, 08:35:25 PM »
I saw those auctions. They struck me as printer's variations, but I'm no expert.

I was amazed coming back into Wackys that they had so many printing variations. Heck, I didn't even know they could be cut differently. Was an unpleasant surprise overall actually.


I noticed a die-cut variation on 6th Broomo Seltzer in my modest collection where the curve seems to change. Like someone bumped the cutting blade part way through production (my guess).

Seems like the hash mark on Kleenaxe is like someone dropped something on the art and/or scratched it part way through production (thus the * change).

I'll have to dig out my Broomo Seltzers and see if I can find that difference I saw. Believe it was when my camera died a few years back and never got to it. Also found a couple others with the 82 or 86 album series that were uncatalogued at the time (believe it was Winstun and the Gadzooka puzzle - was like the first was bumped (curve changed) and the latter was flipped).

Offline RawGoo

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2013, 03:50:06 AM »
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1975-Topps-Wacky-Packages-14th-Series-Complete-30-Card-Set-EX-NM-Variation-s-/190835036655?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT&nma=true&si=a4baozf8zPIdnw8H7g3DzfoQYhE%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc#ht_78wt_1399

This auction got me thinking about 2 questions:
1. Are the 2 variations the seller talks about legitimate variations or just a printing anomoly like running low on ink or something - rotsa root 14th series dark green letters vs. black letters & 14th noose-x blue box vs purple box. I can't even tell a difference from the pics...

2. Is there a page on Rusty's or Greg's site, or somewhere else that lists all 1st to 16th variations in stickers & puzzle pieces? If not, I'll start with a few, and if anyone else knows of any, please chime in.

1. 1st series Maddie Boy & Oddie Boy - Oddie boy has no blue shading in various parts of the sticker
2. 5th series Cram has 2 diecut variations
3. 8th series Kleenaxe has a variation with and without a hash mark above the axe. I believe they correspond to one asterisk copyright & 2 asterisk copyright stickers.

4.  Series 3 Spit and Spill, where the error version has "Spic and Span" on the box lid
5.  Series 7 Grime, with "Dusty-Greasy Chunks" and "Heavy Chunks"
6.  Series 16 Scoot, with and without the copyright
7.  Series 4 puzzles have backs with Choke Wagon and Bum Chex, or Mess Clairoil and Windhex
8.  Series 6 puzzles have backs with Goodman's Looney Noodles and Spills Bad, or Goonman's Looney Noodles and Spills Bros.
9.  Series 8 puzzles have backs with the standard gray cardboard color, or bright white
10. Series 10 puzzles have backs with Pupsi, or without Pupsi listed

Offline Dr Popper

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2013, 06:27:45 AM »
4.  Series 3 Spit and Spill, where the error version has "Spic and Span" on the box lid
5.  Series 7 Grime, with "Dusty-Greasy Chunks" and "Heavy Chunks"
6.  Series 16 Scoot, with and without the copyright
7.  Series 4 puzzles have backs with Choke Wagon and Bum Chex, or Mess Clairoil and Windhex
8.  Series 6 puzzles have backs with Goodman's Looney Noodles and Spills Bad, or Goonman's Looney Noodles and Spills Bros.
9.  Series 8 puzzles have backs with the standard gray cardboard color, or bright white
10. Series 10 puzzles have backs with Pupsi, or without Pupsi listed

There also a couple more obscure ones I know of.........

- The Scary Jane copyright/die-line variation...........



- Flare Pen copyright variation............


Dr Popper (aka Rob Palmer)

Offline Dr Popper

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2013, 06:32:21 AM »
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1975-Topps-Wacky-Packages-14th-Series-Complete-30-Card-Set-EX-NM-Variation-s-/190835036655?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT&nma=true&si=a4baozf8zPIdnw8H7g3DzfoQYhE%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc#ht_78wt_1399

This auction got me thinking about 2 questions:
1. Are the 2 variations the seller talks about legitimate variations or just a printing anomoly like running low on ink or something - rotsa root 14th series dark green letters vs. black letters & 14th noose-x blue box vs purple box. I can't even tell a difference from the pics...

2. Is there a page on Rusty's or Greg's site, or somewhere else that lists all 1st to 16th variations in stickers & puzzle pieces? If not, I'll start with a few, and if anyone else knows of any, please chime in.

1. 1st series Maddie Boy & Oddie Boy - Oddie boy has no blue shading in various parts of the sticker
2. 5th series Cram has 2 diecut variations
3. 8th series Kleenaxe has a variation with and without a hash mark above the axe. I believe they correspond to one asterisk copyright & 2 asterisk copyright stickers.

I don't believe there is an isolated list of all known variations.  I think it's on a series by series basis.  I have a checklist that I created that has them listed, but I don't think Rusty or Greg has a page for them. 

Greg does have a pretty cool page of interesting facts and anomalies.  It's on Greg's site and kind of tricky to find, but if anyone hasn't seen it before it's pretty neat.  Here's the link.........

http://www.wackypacks.com/stickers/wackypackfacts.php?start=1&end=15
     
Dr Popper (aka Rob Palmer)

Offline Kook

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2013, 06:41:59 AM »
There also a couple more obscure ones I know of.........

- Flare Pen copyright variation............




Are there single asterisk flare singles with and without the underscore, or do all single asterisk flares have an underscore, so that makes them a variation from other single asterisk stickers in their series?

Offline Dr Popper

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2013, 06:57:32 AM »
Are there single asterisk flare singles with and without the underscore, or do all single asterisk flares have an underscore, so that makes them a variation from other single asterisk stickers in their series?

The variation only exists with the single * variety, so yes, the single * can be found with and without the underscore.  All double * versions do not have the underscore.  So basically there are 3 versions if you collect both * and **. 

Do you collect them both ways? 
Dr Popper (aka Rob Palmer)

Offline Kook

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2013, 07:06:41 AM »
The variation only exists with the single * variety, so yes, the single * can be found with and without the underscore.  All double * versions do not have the underscore.  So basically there are 3 versions if you collect both * and **.  

Do you collect them both ways?  

I've just been going thru doubles lately, so before I pass on all my extras, I'm considering collecting *, and ** variations and want to check for all other variations as well since it's a lot easier to keep them than find them. I had about 10 crams, and noticed that 8 of the 10 had 2 angle cuts at the top, while only 2 had the 1 vertical & 1 angle, so I'm assuming that diecut pattern is much less common. Do you collect both copyright versions?
« Last Edit: May 16, 2013, 07:12:03 AM by Kook »

Offline Dr Popper

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2013, 07:45:17 AM »
I've just been going thru doubles lately, so before I pass on all my extras, I'm considering collecting *, and ** variations and want to check for all other variations as well since it's a lot easier to keep them than find them. I had about 10 crams, and noticed that 8 of the 10 had 2 angle cuts at the top, while only 2 had the 1 vertical & 1 angle, so I'm assuming that diecut pattern is much less common. Do you collect both copyright versions?

I don't.  I considered it briefly but then I thought of all of the series outside of the S2-16 that have both asterisk versions and I decided I would go broke.  Imagine doing the series 2 black and red ludlows in both * and **, U.K. series, Shedds, etc.   

It would be fun to do just the basic series 2-16 though without back variations.
Dr Popper (aka Rob Palmer)

Offline Porkie

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2013, 07:49:12 AM »
The Flare _ in the copyright is one of my favorites. It's just so odd.

Greg's anomalies page is really neat, and I agree it is very hard to find!

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #10 on: May 16, 2013, 08:13:11 AM »
There also a couple more obscure ones I know of.........

- The Scary Jane copyright/die-line variation...........



 

PSA doesn't need anything else to confuse them about the centering of wackys....they're confused enough as it is!

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #11 on: May 16, 2013, 08:16:09 AM »
I had about 10 crams, and noticed that 8 of the 10 had 2 angle cuts at the top, while only 2 had the 1 vertical & 1 angle, so I'm assuming that diecut pattern is much less common.

Hmmm....seems they should be equally common, since the variant die cut resulted from the replacement of Nastee Crush. So on a given sheet, there should be an equal number of both. I guess it's possible the die cut was corrected at some point, that would make one rarer than the other. Like mostly everything else, I can't remember if this has ever been discussed or not.  :sad:

Offline Bigmuc13

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #12 on: May 17, 2013, 08:56:10 AM »
Hmmm....seems they should be equally common, since the variant die cut resulted from the replacement of Nastee Crush. So on a given sheet, there should be an equal number of both. I guess it's possible the die cut was corrected at some point, that would make one rarer than the other. Like mostly everything else, I can't remember if this has ever been discussed or not.  :sad:

At one point I had about 30 Cram stickers, and I remember looking at the die cuts and it was a pretty even distribution.  Pretty much 50-50.  I don't think either is "rarer" than the other.  I used quotes because this sticker is so common, even if one version was produced less than the other, it stil would be worth around 10 cents.
Still looking for Series 17

Offline Porkie

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #13 on: May 17, 2013, 07:57:59 PM »

- The Scary Jane copyright/die-line variation...........



Was thinking about this today during an off moment: why the heck would the sticker change like this? Is it flipped around (180 degrees) on the sheet? Something else?

Or did they actually move the sticker (not the copyright)? Isn't that hard to do (change the die-cut)?

Offline BustedFinger

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #14 on: May 18, 2013, 05:33:15 AM »
Was thinking about this today during an off moment: why the heck would the sticker change like this? Is it flipped around (180 degrees) on the sheet? Something else?

Or did they actually move the sticker (not the copyright)? Isn't that hard to do (change the die-cut)?

The diecut itself in the upper left corner is markedly different as well.  It is way more rounded on the high sticker than it is on the low sticker.  My guess is that it has to do with the stickers position on the sheet.  It's kind of hard to tell from the sheet images that are on the internet but this one is probably the clearest:

http://www.wackypacks.com/sheets/series10_A.html

It looks like the Scary Jane that is in the third column from the left is the high version and the one on the right edge of the sheet is the low version.

If that is the case, then there may very well be slight variations to Badzooka and Clunky as well.  I suppose this could hold true for other series that only had 30 titles where the first three in the upper left corner are repeated on the right hand side of the sheet.
Giving "The Hobby" the finger since 1999!

Offline Kook

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #15 on: June 19, 2013, 06:40:11 AM »
In looking into os sticker variations a bit more, I have come across an issue with 4th, 5th & 6th series glossy variations.

Regarding frequency:
I have a few hundred 4th series nm stickers, and in looking through them, 0 glossies
about 175 5th series nm stickers & pulled out about 40 glossies
about 175 6th series nm stickers & pulled out 3 glossies

Does anyone have any experience with how common the glossies are in general & by series? I'm trying to determine if my results are a good indication of frequency, or are random/luck of the draw relative to others.

Also, I have found it difficult to confirm if a sticker would be considered a glossy. Especially in the 5th series, it seems I have found 4 relatively distinct finishes with my stickers - the ugly brownish borders, relatively white borders with a kind of matte finish, white borders with a slight gloss i.e. a bit more shiny than the white matte finish borders but noticeably so & there are about 10% of what I would call glossy that have an almost saran wrap finish. Does the term glossy indicate only the saran wrap extreme glossy finish, or would the shiny white bordered stickers also qualify as glossies? I wish I could post scans, but this is a quality that's tough to assess in person, never mind from a scan. Anyone have any insight into this?

Offline Dr Popper

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #16 on: June 19, 2013, 09:58:28 AM »
In looking into os sticker variations a bit more, I have come across an issue with 4th, 5th & 6th series glossy variations.

Regarding frequency:
I have a few hundred 4th series nm stickers, and in looking through them, 0 glossies
about 175 5th series nm stickers & pulled out about 40 glossies
about 175 6th series nm stickers & pulled out 3 glossies

Does anyone have any experience with how common the glossies are in general & by series? I'm trying to determine if my results are a good indication of frequency, or are random/luck of the draw relative to others.

Also, I have found it difficult to confirm if a sticker would be considered a glossy. Especially in the 5th series, it seems I have found 4 relatively distinct finishes with my stickers - the ugly brownish borders, relatively white borders with a kind of matte finish, white borders with a slight gloss i.e. a bit more shiny than the white matte finish borders but noticeably so & there are about 10% of what I would call glossy that have an almost saran wrap finish. Does the term glossy indicate only the saran wrap extreme glossy finish, or would the shiny white bordered stickers also qualify as glossies? I wish I could post scans, but this is a quality that's tough to assess in person, never mind from a scan. Anyone have any insight into this?

In my experience in communicating with a handful of collectors who were assembling these glossy sets over the years, series 6 is actually tougher than series 4 to get the glossy fronts.  Series 5 is obviously the easiest as probably 25-30% of them are glossy.  The glossy ones don't seem to have the "tanning" issue that the matte finish ones do and as a result appear whiter, and there is a noticeable difference in the shine when held at an angle to light.  They don't have that "toothy" texture that the matte ones do.  It's almost impossible to tell with a picture or scan though, so they really need to be seen in person, which adds to the difficulty of collecting them. 

There are probably some slight variations with series 5 as they were probably buying paper from different mills to fulfill their abundance of orders, and they may have had to get what was available at the time to keep the presses rolling.

My 5th series all are consistently white and have a smoother finish than the mattes.  If there is any browning or surfaces that seem to be in between the two surfaces I don't include them in my glossy collection.

If you remind me before the Fall show I'll bring you my book to show you what mine look like.

 

Dr Popper (aka Rob Palmer)

Offline Kook

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #17 on: June 19, 2013, 11:28:18 AM »
In my experience in communicating with a handful of collectors who were assembling these glossy sets over the years, series 6 is actually tougher than series 4 to get the glossy fronts.  Series 5 is obviously the easiest as probably 25-30% of them are glossy.  The glossy ones don't seem to have the "tanning" issue that the matte finish ones do and as a result appear whiter, and there is a noticeable difference in the shine when held at an angle to light.  They don't have that "toothy" texture that the matte ones do.  It's almost impossible to tell with a picture or scan though, so they really need to be seen in person, which adds to the difficulty of collecting them.  

There are probably some slight variations with series 5 as they were probably buying paper from different mills to fulfill their abundance of orders, and they may have had to get what was available at the time to keep the presses rolling.

My 5th series all are consistently white and have a smoother finish than the mattes.  If there is any browning or surfaces that seem to be in between the two surfaces I don't include them in my glossy collection.

If you remind me before the Fall show I'll bring you my book to show you what mine look like.

Thanks Rob. Do you know about the rarity of the 1985 non-glossy backed variation vs the 1985 glossy? I have a handful of non-glossy backed 1985 stickers & was wondering how hard it will be to complete the set.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2013, 11:30:15 AM by Kook »

Offline Dr Popper

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #18 on: June 20, 2013, 01:04:53 PM »
Thanks Rob. Do you know about the rarity of the 1985 non-glossy backed variation vs the 1985 glossy? I have a handful of non-glossy backed 1985 stickers & was wondering how hard it will be to complete the set.

I would say around 10% are uncoated, so it's definitely attainable.  It's just a pain in the neck because you have to either just keep buying batches and looking through them or wait for the shows to see them in person because it's not really something you can see on a computer screen. 

John Frick (Scary Lee) assembled my set so maybe he can chime in on how he found them.   
Dr Popper (aka Rob Palmer)

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #19 on: July 23, 2020, 04:09:41 PM »
There also a couple more obscure ones I know of.........

- The Scary Jane copyright/die-line variation...........



- Flare Pen copyright variation............


« Last Edit: July 23, 2020, 04:51:38 PM by RawGoo »

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #20 on: July 23, 2020, 04:10:20 PM »
I found the thread discussing the Scary Jane but canít find any surviving images....

Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #21 on: July 23, 2020, 04:53:12 PM »
yeah, the usual tricks to resuscitate the old images aren't working with these

here's new shots I made



Offline RawGoo

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #22 on: July 23, 2020, 04:55:40 PM »
I found the thread discussing the Scary Jane but canít find any surviving images....

I tried to fix it, but it didn't work.  Please PM me the thread so I can try again.

Offline Paul_Maul

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #23 on: July 23, 2020, 10:25:44 PM »
I tried to fix it, but it didn't work.  Please PM me the thread so I can try again.

I think the problem is that the images expired, not the .cc issue.

Offline RawGoo

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #24 on: July 23, 2020, 10:34:54 PM »
I think the problem is that the images expired, not the .cc issue.

Darn.  Thanks for the info.

Offline BustedFinger

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #25 on: July 27, 2020, 10:19:43 AM »
yeah, the usual tricks to resuscitate the old images aren't working with these

here's new shots I made

(Image removed from quote.)
(Image removed from quote.)
Curious - Is it always the two asterisk copyright that is closer?
Giving "The Hobby" the finger since 1999!

Offline ToadallyDude

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Re: Original series sticker variations
« Reply #26 on: August 01, 2020, 12:25:05 AM »
Quote
The Flare _ in the copyright is one of my favorites. It's just so odd.

So cool to hear people talking about mysteries & variations again!  Always liked that aspect of Wackys.  "Flare Pen_" was one of my early spots, too, so I've always been partial to that one.  When I brought it up to the Wacky Wizards of the time, no one had ever noticed it before.  No real value, of course, but SO weird that no one at Topps caught that mistake on something as important as a copyright.  Same with the yellow-pack posters being 1/2" longer.  Weird find, but didn't seem to effect value or interest that much.  (...although "Snoot = Saunders", I waited to announce until after I bought the art in Roxanne's auction... slightly jerkish blend maybe, but y'all would'a done da same).  Back 'den, we din't have no "Oddie Boy", 'doh.  (not sure why I digressed into a gangster voice)