Author Topic: Beware of matt stock!!  (Read 8389 times)

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Offline Kook-Aid

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Beware of matt stock!!
« on: April 14, 2010, 03:26:30 PM »
I wouldnt buy anything from Matt.He sold me a die cut set with stains,creases & 3 of the cards had popped perfs.He described these cards as strictly EX/NM Condition in his ebay auction.To Top it all off he was Very Rude & Unprofessional & also tried using Greg as leverage and lied to me!!Just figured id share my ebay buying experience here with everyone.

His ebay user id is make-mine-marvel
« Last Edit: April 17, 2010, 04:06:29 PM by Kook-Aid »

Offline BumChex

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2010, 03:39:56 PM »
I wouldnt buy anything from Matt.He sold me a die cut set with stains,creases & 3 of the cards had popped perfs.He described these cards as strictly EX+/NM Condition in his ebay auction.To Top it all off he was Very Rude & Unprofessional & also tried using Greg as leverage and lied to me!!Just figured id share my ebay buying experience here with everyone.

His ebay user id is make-mine-marvel

The guy is shady! He doesn't use any pics of the cards. His pics are rehash of old auctions. I would ask for a refund. He probably will give you one. If he doesn't then make sure to let everyone know about it on the forum. I don't trust him at all. He has done that to me also but did replace the cards. If you get on his bad side he will pout like a little boy and be very rude.
I don't care if he reads this and gets pissed because he has done this to several people. His business practice is to hope you don't bitch so he can unload crappy cards to unsuspecting new collectors. He will replace them but he is betting people won't bring it up or deal with the hastle. Notice every auction he has is NM?
I have bought from him a couple times and both times he had to replace cards. Not worth dealing with him.
Do you have a link to the auction?

Offline Kook-Aid

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2010, 03:47:50 PM »
Yes you hit the nail on the head with what you  said!!!Thats the problem he refused to give me a refund.Not even a partial refund($150).Jolly Mean Giant was one with 2 popped perfs!!.Now if these issues im speaking about were mentioned in his auction that wouldve been different.He let all the pics do the talking .How am i supposed to see popped perfs,stains on backs & creases in a pic??I bought a 15 series set off him a few years back and he did replace three of the cards.

 >:D

Offline BumChex

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2010, 04:55:58 PM »
Yes you hit the nail on the head with what you  said!!!Thats the problem he refused to give me a refund.Not even a partial refund($150).Jolly Mean Giant was one with 2 popped perfs!!.Now if these issues im speaking about were mentioned in his auction that wouldve been different.He let all the pics do the talking .How am i supposed to see popped perfs,stains on backs & creases in a pic??I bought a 15 series set off him a few years back and he did replace three of the cards.

 >:D
Did you pay with paypal? Put in a dispute if you did.

Offline Kook-Aid

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2010, 04:58:57 PM »
I did put a dispute in with paypal but they said i needed a third party opinion.I dont have anyone around me that specializes in wacky packs:(

Offline Kook-Aid

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #5 on: April 14, 2010, 05:05:04 PM »
He took the pictures down after i bought the set.I wouldve never bought them if i had known these issues(stains,creases,popped perfs) beforehand!!

Offline BumChex

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #6 on: April 14, 2010, 05:29:06 PM »
I did put a dispute in with paypal but they said i needed a third party opinion.I dont have anyone around me that specializes in wacky packs:(

I thought if there was a dispute you could return for a full credit? Something doesn't seem right. He also has no returns accepted. crook!
« Last Edit: April 14, 2010, 05:33:27 PM by BumChex »

Offline Kook-Aid

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #7 on: April 14, 2010, 05:50:17 PM »
I asked for a partial refund first from him and he thought i was off my rocker!!!Basically Matt is a bastard coated bastard with a bastard filling .

Offline BumChex

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #8 on: April 14, 2010, 09:29:54 PM »
I asked for a partial refund first from him and he thought i was off my rocker!!!Basically Matt is a bastard coated bastard with a bastard filling .

I think the guy is bi-polar. He has turned onme for something fairly harmless. He used my picture for one of his auctions. I messages him and all I said was 'nice picture, looks familiar'. Then things turned ugly. He gave me some excuse about not having time to scan a picture sohewould use mine. I told him it's not that big of deal but it's confusing when people look at auctions and see the same pictures. He then said he would remove it and that I shouldn't email him any more. I said no big deal just scan your own pictures and then he wrote back saying I should never email him again and that he won't use my pictures again and to leave him alone. WOW! I have dealt with Matt before and have exchanged emails but hejust got totally irate with me when he could have laughed it off and said something like " you caught me, no prob, I will change it now" but he didn't. He asked me twice to not bother him again. That doesn't sound like a great seller who wants you back for repeat biz.

Offline Kook-Aid

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #9 on: April 14, 2010, 09:42:41 PM »
Basically when i confronted him on this issue he told me i was a jerk & a total idiot and i was never to  do business with him again!!He also told me greg will never do business with me either.I asked him if not doing business with me was a threat or a promise??He said a promise and no need for me to email back and to consider our business dealings closed at this point!!!!

Offline BumChex

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #10 on: April 15, 2010, 06:33:06 AM »
Basically when i confronted him on this issue he told me i was a jerk & a total idiot and i was never to  do business with him again!!He also told me greg will never do business with me either.I asked him if not doing business with me was a threat or a promise??He said a promise and no need for me to email back and to consider our business dealings closed at this point!!!!
The funny thing is that Greg probably has no idea about this. The guy is totally loony.

Offline bandaches

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #11 on: April 15, 2010, 07:45:26 AM »
I think the guy is bi-polar. He has turned onme for something fairly harmless. He used my picture for one of his auctions. I messages him and all I said was 'nice picture, looks familiar'. Then things turned ugly. He gave me some excuse about not having time to scan a picture sohewould use mine. I told him it's not that big of deal but it's confusing when people look at auctions and see the same pictures. He then said he would remove it and that I shouldn't email him any more. I said no big deal just scan your own pictures and then he wrote back saying I should never email him again and that he won't use my pictures again and to leave him alone. WOW! I have dealt with Matt before and have exchanged emails but hejust got totally irate with me when he could have laughed it off and said something like " you caught me, no prob, I will change it now" but he didn't. He asked me twice to not bother him again. That doesn't sound like a great seller who wants you back for repeat biz.
So he used your pictures for financial gain purposes?  I don't recall his standing behind Jay when he used greg's website pictures for non-monetary gains.  Where are all of the people who fought tooth and nail against Jay's use of other pictures and why are they not saying anything about matt?  Are they all afraid of him just because matt threatened me with physical violence over forum chat years ago?
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Offline bandaches

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #12 on: April 15, 2010, 07:53:44 AM »
The funny thing is that Greg probably has no idea about this. The guy is totally loony.
greg and matt are best friends, how did you come to the conclusion that greg doesn't know matt and how he deals with people who challenge him? 

greg is fully aware that matt threatened me with physical violence using greg's forum as the mode of communication and greg is fully aware that the private message matt sent me has the full details of the threat and didn't match matt's editted version that he posted in public for everyone.  greg didn't want to discuss the matter any further because he said he knew there were legal ramifications and that because I threatened to turn the matter over to my local police.  I think I might even still have greg's note where he says he didn't want to discuss it for those reasons.  I think suggesting greg is oblivious to his friend matt's behavior in the hobby would be a stretch.  They claim to partner on a large number of wacky pack deals.

Is greg aware that matt is using greg as "quality" leverage when he sends crap out to people, that I am not sure of, I wouldn't think greg would be happy about that nor can I see how greg can do his double talk magic on how that can be ok.

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Offline Duznt

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #13 on: April 15, 2010, 08:26:50 AM »
I did put a dispute in with paypal but they said i needed a third party opinion.I dont have anyone around me that specializes in wacky packs:(

There are quite a few Wacky Pack experts on this forum that could be a third party I'm sure...

Offline Kook-Aid

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #14 on: April 15, 2010, 11:40:22 AM »
Yes but paypal wanted someone that has a legit business to provide documentation on company letterhead stating the exact condition of the cards in question

Offline Duznt

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #15 on: April 15, 2010, 03:12:34 PM »
Yes but paypal wanted someone that has a legit business to provide documentation on company letterhead stating the exact condition of the cards in question

Does it have to be someone who deals with Wackys? If not, check with a local sports card shop near you. It should be pretty easy to see those problems you described (stains, creases, etc.). Maybe even a comic shop that deals with non-sports cards? Hopefully you can find someone in one of those places that understands card grading.

Offline RonZombie

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #16 on: April 15, 2010, 03:20:43 PM »
Does it have to be someone who deals with Wackys? If not, check with a local sports card shop near you. It should be pretty easy to see those problems you described (stains, creases, etc.). Maybe even a comic shop that deals with non-sports cards? Hopefully you can find someone in one of those places that understands card grading.

I could be wrong (imagine that!) but I believe there was already an investigation and they found in "Matts" favor, this is "2nd hand news" it's what I read on the (other) forum. :^)
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Offline Kook-Aid

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #17 on: April 15, 2010, 03:44:40 PM »
Yes they found in matts favor because i never followed up with a documented submission on the issues i described

Offline bandaches

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #18 on: April 15, 2010, 08:34:34 PM »
I could be wrong (imagine that!) but I believe there was already an investigation and they found in "Matts" favor, this is "2nd hand news" it's what I read on the (other) forum. :^)
Does that thread show the scans of the auction and then show the scans of the product received?  Ebay findings doesn't "prove" anything as it could be the administrative process made it impossible for the buyer to prevail.  Please copy those pics here.
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Offline bandaches

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #19 on: April 15, 2010, 08:35:05 PM »
Yes they found in matts favor because i never followed up with a documented submission on the issues i described
editted due to getting my answer in another thread.

If anyone is bored, feel free to use any of the following ids(password is the same as the id) on greg's forum and let me know how you make out:

greg
grape
cherry
isa
coward
« Last Edit: April 15, 2010, 09:14:25 PM by bandaches »
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Offline BumChex

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #20 on: April 15, 2010, 11:17:32 PM »
editted due to getting my answer in another thread.

If anyone is bored, feel free to use any of the following ids(password is the same as the id) on greg's forum and let me know how you make out:

greg
grape
cherry
isa
coward

OK. I used one of your ID's and it works just fine. He must be blocking your IP so you might want to try from work. Basically this same topic has been posted but Matt has not chimed in. Ironically, Greg has and said he saw the set and came up with some figure that 3 cards don't equal $150. The buyer chimed in and said it's more then the 3 cards and that most had staining and creased corners. Greg basically blew him off and said you don't have a case.
I am sure the scans for the auction were not the actual scans (as I have said many times before). Even if they were the front scans it wouldn't show the busted perfs and the staining on the back. Matt never shows the backs of his cards so who would know. You guys might like Matt and Greg. I have no issues at all with Greg as he has been very fair with me in all of my dealings but I don't care for Matt and I will hold my feelings on my sleeve. I know Greg is friends with Matt and know I think he is sticking up for him but, from the other forum posts, that there is still no evidence, no pictures at all. It's ones word against the other.
I truly believe the buyer is telling the truth. Why would he lie and make it so public? If he bought of EX+/NM die cuts for $1000 I don't think you would hear a peep out of him. To me that is too good of a deal to pass up. If you fellow collectors can't see through the holes in this then that's too bad because you all know that Matt will not sell sets cheap. He has the highest prices sets on ebay and he would never sell a really nice condition for that price.
Let's compare some of Matts auctions and you will see what I mean:

Series 1-16 sets
http://cgi.ebay.com/Wacky-Packages-Series-1-to-16-COMPLETE-SETS_W0QQitemZ290379722520
Series 1 set
http://cgi.ebay.com/Wacky-Packages-Series-1-Complete-Set-WOW-1973_W0QQitemZ290398723377
Hmmmm. Those first 2 scans look alike. Look at the kook. Anything look familiar?


Series 12 set up for auction now:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Wacky-Packages-Series-12-Complete-Set-TOPPS-1974_W0QQitemZ290398722851

Completed 12th series auction
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290372973450

Anything look a bit familiar? I am sure you can find something?

Series 11 Set available now:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Wacky-Packages-Series-11-Complete-Set-TOPPS_W0QQitemZ290398723129
Wait! didn't he just sell this set:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290372973053
Maybe I am crazy for believing he uses the same pictures?

Hold on....
Didn't he just sell this set:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290372970366

My mistake, the guy just left feedback for this newly listed auction:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Wacky-Packages-Series-1-Complete-Set-WOW-1973_W0QQitemZ290398723377
OMG, there is that same miscut kook-aid. What are the odds this would be the same miscut Kook-aid in 3 auctions?

I don't know if you guys don't get it or don't want to get it but this is not much of a witch hunt. It's the facts! Don't believe any of this guys auctions and you will be safe. You might think Matt is your friend but he is just a businessman waiting to take your cash. You can say that I haven't heard both sides to voice an opinion but I think I have left enough examples to rule in the courts favor. What you see is what you don't get. I am surprised that most of you guys that frequent Ebay have never picked up on this. It's kinda sad.
You might ask why I am sticking up for this guy that I hardly know? Why would I rat out Matt like this? The truth is the truth and I have been very silent about this until this guy came forward. These are facts and I totally believe him. We don't need to push him at all because he got burned by one of the good guys from the other forum. A guy we know sells a ton of wacky's and have had good dealings with him. The fact is he knows you guys and will not intentionally try to screw you over. He is going for new blood, one that won't be so vocal. He just crossed the line and is being publicly ridiculed. He may never read this but I hope he does and tries to defend this post because he will lose.
I think I have spent enough energy on Matt and I want to make sure other new collectors don't get burned. That is why I am so passionate about this thread and why I am so vocal on this subject. I am tired of his antics and people really need to know what they are dealing with.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2010, 11:22:50 PM by BumChex »

Offline Crakola Crayons

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #21 on: April 16, 2010, 03:05:14 AM »
Ernie, I tried the greg/greg combo and was able to log into the new forum with no problem.  Did not post anything though.
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Offline Duznt

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #22 on: April 16, 2010, 08:07:14 AM »
OK. I used one of your ID's and it works just fine. He must be blocking your IP so you might want to try from work. Basically this same topic has been posted but Matt has not chimed in. Ironically, Greg has and said he saw the set and came up with some figure that 3 cards don't equal $150. The buyer chimed in and said it's more then the 3 cards and that most had staining and creased corners. Greg basically blew him off and said you don't have a case.

As you've said, we haven't heard Matt's side of this. However, since he's the seller, it would be in his best interest to work something out with the buyer. I always thought of Matt having a fairly good reputation until now, which is why this doesn't make sense to me. I remember reading about how he gave refunds or whatever, so why not this time?

Offline bandaches

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #23 on: April 16, 2010, 10:18:25 AM »
Ernie, I tried the greg/greg combo and was able to log into the new forum with no problem.  Did not post anything though.
All of my ids allow me to log in, then the system times out before I can go to any threads so greg has been clearly accumulating my IP addresses and having them time out.  No biggie, he announced he was going to make it the "ernie blackball" thread.
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Offline bandaches

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #24 on: April 16, 2010, 10:23:18 AM »
As you've said, we haven't heard Matt's side of this. However, since he's the seller, it would be in his best interest to work something out with the buyer. I always thought of Matt having a fairly good reputation until now, which is why this doesn't make sense to me. I remember reading about how he gave refunds or whatever, so why not this time?

Has everyone somehow forgotten that matt was the biggest shill bidder on ebay in regards to wacky packs?  I would say he easily had like 10 ids and would run up his own auctions.  He has defended it in varying ways from denying it, to saying the big auction houses allow it so therefore it is ok to declaring he has stopped doing it.  Phil Carpent ran an ebay auction that detailed this to let everyone know what was going on.  Let me see if I can dig it up as I saved it in my wacky pack archives.

matt relies on thuggery to quiet people as he stated to me in a PM "next time I see you, I am going to knock you out".  He then tried to post an eddited version of that threat to try to convince everyone he never threatened me and then he tried to claim he meant next time he sees me on the message board he would knock me out with messages.  Just how stupid does he really think the folks in this hobby are?

Now it all makes perfect sense that greg has latched his wagon on to the matt train for all of these years.
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Offline Duznt

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #25 on: April 16, 2010, 04:32:40 PM »
Has everyone somehow forgotten that matt was the biggest shill bidder on ebay in regards to wacky packs?  I would say he easily had like 10 ids and would run up his own auctions.  He has defended it in varying ways from denying it, to saying the big auction houses allow it so therefore it is ok to declaring he has stopped doing it.  Phil Carpent ran an ebay auction that detailed this to let everyone know what was going on.  Let me see if I can dig it up as I saved it in my wacky pack archives.

matt relies on thuggery to quiet people as he stated to me in a PM "next time I see you, I am going to knock you out".  He then tried to post an eddited version of that threat to try to convince everyone he never threatened me and then he tried to claim he meant next time he sees me on the message board he would knock me out with messages.  Just how stupid does he really think the folks in this hobby are?

Now it all makes perfect sense that greg has latched his wagon on to the matt train for all of these years.


I don't remember reading about the shill bidding thing. Must have missed that.

Offline 21Fold

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #26 on: April 17, 2010, 08:17:21 AM »
Thankfully I have only had one encounter with Matt Stock and it was in April 2008.  He is clearly suffering from an untreated personality disorder.  He is immature, ill-tempered, hostile and confrontational.  Also quite deficient in the IQ department which makes it impossible to communicate with.  I would not sell to him so I certainly I would never consider buying anything from him.  He is an unstable element and I am quite confident that it is not just in regards to Wackies. 

Kook-Aid I am sorry I did not see this thread earlier.  I have been a dealer of vintage baseball cards since 1989 and would have been more than happy to provide you with an assessment on Wackies you bought from Matt and should they have been different than he described I would have provided you something in writing on my letterhead.

Greg

Offline BumChex

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #27 on: April 17, 2010, 09:00:10 AM »
Thankfully I have only had one encounter with Matt Stock and it was in April 2008.  He is clearly suffering from an untreated personality disorder.  He is immature, ill-tempered, hostile and confrontational.  Also quite deficient in the IQ department which makes it impossible to communicate with.  I would not sell to him so I certainly I would never consider buying anything from him.  He is an unstable element and I am quite confident that it is not just in regards to Wackies. 

Kook-Aid I am sorry I did not see this thread earlier.  I have been a dealer of vintage baseball cards since 1989 and would have been more than happy to provide you with an assessment on Wackies you bought from Matt and should they have been different than he described I would have provided you something in writing on my letterhead.

Greg
Hi Greg,
Welcome to the forum. You mention you are a dealer, is this just ebay or do you have a website as well?

Offline 21Fold

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #28 on: April 17, 2010, 11:14:19 AM »
Thanks Brad.  Used to sell lots of stuff on ebay but have phased out and now consign to the larger auction houses. 

Offline bandaches

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #29 on: April 27, 2010, 06:08:26 PM »
I had an opportunity to use an IP address that greg hasn't blocked so I berused the posts on his forum, only took a few minutes as not much going on there but I found it interesting that for some reason the "education" the new folks are receiving over there is that Jolly Mean Diecut is nothing special, that popped perfs are a minor imperfection that keeps a card Ex or higher and that edge to diecut creases are common on Ex+ graded diecuts.  Somewhat ridiculous to suggest that Jolly Mean gets equal weight with the rest of the set in discussing a refund related to sending a Jolly Mean with several popped perfs.  Clearly, of the base 44, Jolly Mean easily sells for the most.
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Offline Jean Nutty

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #30 on: April 28, 2010, 05:54:01 PM »
Thankfully I have only had one encounter with Matt Stock and it was in April 2008.  He is clearly suffering from an untreated personality disorder.  He is immature, ill-tempered, hostile and confrontational.  Also quite deficient in the IQ department which makes it impossible to communicate with.  I would not sell to him so I certainly I would never consider buying anything from him.  He is an unstable element and I am quite confident that it is not just in regards to Wackies. 

Kook-Aid I am sorry I did not see this thread earlier.  I have been a dealer of vintage baseball cards since 1989 and would have been more than happy to provide you with an assessment on Wackies you bought from Matt and should they have been different than he described I would have provided you something in writing on my letterhead.

Greg
Welcome to the forum Greg!
Were you a member of the Greg Grant's forum, or is this your first WP message board?

Offline 21Fold

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #31 on: April 29, 2010, 08:47:59 PM »
Thank you!

I was on Greg's forum under the same ID.  I did not post much there and did more lurking. 

Nice to be here.

Greg

Offline BumChex

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Re: Beware of matt stock!!
« Reply #32 on: April 29, 2010, 09:27:24 PM »
Thank you!

I was on Greg's forum under the same ID.  I did not post much there and did more lurking. 

Nice to be here.

Greg

Great to see you here. No need to lurk, just post. All is fun! I think some people were a bit intimided on the other forum, I know I was as a newbie to the hobby. There is nothing to worry about here. Everyone here is here to help with your collecting needs. Even if it's a rehash of what has been said before because there are newer people to the hobby every day and hopefully we can save collectors the frustration we have all had. This forum is to inform. If you don't ask questions you may never get the answers you desire.
Have fun!