Pack Searchers

[Playbug]

For a moment there, I thought you were writing a letter to Penthouse.

Good one !

[Playbug]

One word... Aliens!   Conspiratorially speaking. They need sketch cards to fuel their ships and gold border cards for.. Well, I'm not really sure. They didn't explain it well in the recent documentary I watched called COWBOYS VERSUS ALIENS

First crop circles, now pack searchers !

[Fanatical_and_Sickly]

I stopped at a Target yesterday to pick up the gravity feed box. There were only 10 packs left, and checking them out, most seemed 'searched'. But some had the 'front' cards pushed up, others had the cards moved around, but not cleanly. I bought 5 packs just to purchase something with the feed. Got 2 magnets and 1 silver. Not bad.

[lucidjc]

I stopped at a Target yesterday to pick up the gravity feed box. There were only 10 packs left, and checking them out, most seemed 'searched'. But some had the 'front' cards pushed up, others had the cards moved around, but not cleanly. I bought 5 packs just to purchase something with the feed. Got 2 magnets and 1 silver. Not bad.

Oh no doubt great cards are slipping by the searchers. Just like people got rich off of gold tailings. They are going for the nuggets and leaving the dust behind.

[Dr Popper]

Call me crazy... I tried the magnet trick on my own packs I already bought, in curiosity, and got 3 for 3 Silver border packs and obviously magnet too but only 1 for 1 on that so far.

To repeat, I was not pack searching in the strictest of terms because I was searching my own already bought packs. It is very slightly magnetic with the silver packs. I would almost assume gold would too but haven't been that lucky yet and having only opened 12 packs, obviously haven't came across gold. Also I realize "gold" isn't magnetic but neither is "silver" so...

(btw, a really strong magnet, NdFeB about 1/2 inch long 1/4 inch diameter rod type)

It's possible that's how they are doing it then.  I never thought about it but they are probably using metallic inks to get that affect, and it might be enough to pick up on a strong magnet.

[Playbug]

I guess ANS 9 will have to use Black wrappers that are totally NON-see through. Black wrappers might look really cool. 

[bandaches]

I stopped at a Target yesterday to pick up the gravity feed box. There were only 10 packs left, and checking them out, most seemed 'searched'. But some had the 'front' cards pushed up, others had the cards moved around, but not cleanly. I bought 5 packs just to purchase something with the feed. Got 2 magnets and 1 silver. Not bad.

I think we are way overestimating the number of pack searchers who are out there combing every target to pick packs.  I bet some of the packs just naturally have some shuffling of the cards hence the front or back card is slightly shifted.  I am not saying pack searching isn't taking place but being paranoid into thinking every pack in a non full box in a retail store has been searched is ridiculous.

[bigtomi]

Black wrappers might look really cool.

This one looks pretty cool.

[ScaryLee]

Not sure why any magnet would pick up anything in a silver bordered sticker. I stood a silver sticker on edge carefully balanced just ready to tip over and waved a 350 pound magnet (meaning that its powerful enough to lift 350 pounds) right next to it and there was no movement from the card whatsover. If I do this with the same magnet and an ans8 magnet i can get it to tip over by holding the magnet as much as 3 inches away.

[loki]

I don't know, I definitely felt something, however slight and had 3 successful guesses.

[ScaryLee]

I don't know, I definitely felt something, however slight and had 3 successful guesses.

Interesting. I definitely believe you.

[Playbug]

This one looks pretty cool.

See, that'll stop the pack searchers. 

[bandaches]

Not sure why any magnet would pick up anything in a silver bordered sticker. I stood a silver sticker on edge carefully balanced just ready to tip over and waved a 350 pound magnet (meaning that its powerful enough to lift 350 pounds) right next to it and there was no movement from the card whatsover. If I do this with the same magnet and an ans8 magnet i can get it to tip over by holding the magnet as much as 3 inches away.

Damn, I want to see you balance a card on its edge!  Dude you must have some serious steady hands! 

[bandaches]

I don't know, I definitely felt something, however slight and had 3 successful guesses.

I wonder if the pattern with silver is the theft detector that seems to be in random packs.  Did you find this to be a factor? I would imagine the theft detector is magnetic.

[Dr Popper]

Not sure why any magnet would pick up anything in a silver bordered sticker. I stood a silver sticker on edge carefully balanced just ready to tip over and waved a 350 pound magnet (meaning that its powerful enough to lift 350 pounds) right next to it and there was no movement from the card whatsover. If I do this with the same magnet and an ans8 magnet i can get it to tip over by holding the magnet as much as 3 inches away.

Well that experiment seems to discredit the magnet theory.  Sounds like you tried it with a strong magnet too.  If you lie a silver flash flat on a table the magnet won't lift it at all, or even try to lift it?

[Playbug]

Was at Target tonight and picked up 3 packs from the Gravity Feed. It did not feel like the cards were slid up. BUT, I did try to see the top 1st 3 cards like what was mentioned in this thread and it seems to be impossible. Under no lighting situation could I see through the packs to even see the black boarder of the top card let alone 2nd or 3rd one down. I waited until I got home to try it again under different lights and could not see anything. I really do not see how it is possible to do any searching this way. Not that I want to anyway, but am happy that it is not easy to do. So I think that the only way to predict the pack is by opening up cases and figuring out the collation. Unless I am missing something here, I do not see it as plausible to "look through and into" the actual wrapper.

[Bigmuc13]

I was at Target today and thought I would check out the Wackys they had there.  There was an open gravity feed,  I pulled out all of the packs and lookd them over.  All but two of the packs has the cards slid up in the package, so it appears that someone looked through these.  So I bought those two.  I agree, I have no idea how you could see anything through the wrapper.  I looked at it under bright light at home and still no luck.  To me, it is imposible to tell what stickers are in the pack.  When I opened the packs, I got nothing terribly special.  The extras were a Beanball lenticular bag tag, a crust magnet, and two pink borders.  Those were the first two packs from ANS8 that I have purchased.

[Playbug]

I was at Target today and thought I would check out the Wackys they had there.  There was an open gravity feed,  I pulled out all of the packs and lookd them over.  All but two of the packs has the cards slid up in the package, so it appears that someone looked through these.  So I bought those two.  I agree, I have no idea how you could see anything through the wrapper.  I looked at it under bright light at home and still no luck.  To me, it is imposible to tell what stickers are in the pack.  When I opened the packs, I got nothing terribly special.  The extras were a Beanball lenticular bag tag, a crust magnet, and two pink borders.  Those were the first two packs from ANS8 that I have purchased.

I was lucky, (forgot to mention) out of those 3 GF Target packs I pulled a Silver and a Motion. 

[Dr Popper]

I've noticed that there's a seller called "hotpackcity" who has recently been selling a bunch of ANS8 sketch cards.  He seems to have some sort of system worked out. 

[BumChex]

I've noticed that there's a seller called "hotpackcity" who has recently been selling a bunch of ANS8 sketch cards.  He seems to have some sort of system worked out. 

Um...I think he is called hot pack city for a reason....LOL
He has searched enough packs to pull the sketches. Do you guys also notice that you rarely see a gold hot pack? It's because they can't see a gold through the wrapper.

[Playbug]

I've noticed that there's a seller called "hotpackcity" who has recently been selling a bunch of ANS8 sketch cards.  He seems to have some sort of system worked out. 

Yeah, I also noticed that it seems 'hot pack city' cannot figure the exact pack it will be in, so they throw up usually 5 packs to cover where they think the gold - silver or sketch may appear.

But refering to what Brad just said in the last post, they cannot see the gold borders through the packs. I don't belive you can even see the black boarders through the packs, I definately think these people are buying a ton of cases and examining the collation to figure out the odds of a gold - silver or sketch. I also wish there was no way of figuring it out, but unfortunately there seems to be a way and this cannot be good for collectors overall.

[lucidjc]

Yeah, I also noticed that it seems 'hot pack city' cannot figure the exact pack it will be in, so they throw up usually 5 packs to cover where they think the gold - silver or sketch may appear.

But refering to what Brad just said in the last post, they cannot see the gold borders through the packs. I don't belive you can even see the black boarders through the packs, I definately think these people are buying a ton of cases and examining the collation to figure out the odds of a gold - silver or sketch. I also wish there was no way of figuring it out, but unfortunately there seems to be a way and this cannot be good for collectors overall.

I think he throws up the 5-10 hot packs for sale to get rid of the silvers by claiming there still might be a sketch or gold. i dont see him selling any loose golds so those may be the harder to tell packs, but he for sure has a system worked out for the sketches, besides Gary he has the most up. Gary at least sells swill which tells me Gary is opening alot of product, not so much with "hotpackcity". This guy "KNOWS" something we dont. He has packs from many other sports so there is definitly a system.

[BumChex]

Yeah, I also noticed that it seems 'hot pack city' cannot figure the exact pack it will be in, so they throw up usually 5 packs to cover where they think the gold - silver or sketch may appear.

But refering to what Brad just said in the last post, they cannot see the gold borders through the packs. I don't belive you can even see the black boarders through the packs, I definately think these people are buying a ton of cases and examining the collation to figure out the odds of a gold - silver or sketch. I also wish there was no way of figuring it out, but unfortunately there seems to be a way and this cannot be good for collectors overall.

They can see through the pack to see if it's a hot pack or not. I don't know exactly how they do it but it's not about collation. They can see through the pack. One of the sellers told me how they do it and I just explained it. There is no mystery. These guys know how to push cards and see through packs. It is really frustration to go out and buy packs that have been searched. We are the ones keeping the series alive.

[Playbug]

They can see through the pack to see if it's a hot pack or not. I don't know exactly how they do it but it's not about collation. They can see through the pack. One of the sellers told me how they do it and I just explained it. There is no mystery. These guys know how to push cards and see through packs. It is really frustration to go out and buy packs that have been searched. We are the ones keeping the series alive.

Sad news indeed. They must have something that cancels out the blue wrapper - I got it - 3D Glasses. 

Someone should tell Topps about this. So what are the odds reduced to with the inclusion of Pack Searchers? Sounds like a skill question for the potential Canadians. 

[Porkie]

Wonder if it's an LED or other unusual type light that does the trick, perhaps a different color bulb.

I'll try my ultra-bright LED flashlight on a new pack this week sometime, as well as a very bright red LED flashlight and see if I can tell anything.

It is really frustrating to know that someone can pull the goodies at will like this...

[Feetena]

gosh, when I hear stuff like this, all I can think is that people can really suck. 

[bigfoot67]

Upper Deck addressed this during their inaugural year of production in 1989. Pack searching and resealing wax packs as well as pulling hot packs due to poor card collation was rampant in sports cards. The paper/foil crimped packs looked nice and seemed effective in deterring searchers. Why not go back to that?

[lucidjc]

I guess they are still at it...heres a new one


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wacky-Packages-ANS8-1-1-Artist-Sketch-Card-Hot-Pack-Tough-Find-1-973-/160664306957?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item256856c50d

[Playbug]

I guess they are still at it...heres a new one


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wacky-Packages-ANS8-1-1-Artist-Sketch-Card-Hot-Pack-Tough-Find-1-973-/160664306957?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item256856c50d

WTF, this is flat out wrong with one exception IMO. That is, if they bought a HUGE amount of cases and have figured out a pattern. I can say this because then it is - shame on the folks responsible for the collation and I couldn't blame the buyer for investing to "crack the code". But what I understand from this thread is that it is apparently able to be done pretty easy and quickly somehow even right in the store. It still is bewildering to me and I feel like a dummy cuz usually I am pretty good at figuring out techniques like this. I guess these Pack Searchers have gone to school for forensics or something. Dang.

[lucidjc]

WTF, this is flat out wrong with one exception IMO. That is, if they bought a HUGE amount of cases and have figured out a pattern. I can say this because then it is - shame on the folks responsible for the collation and I couldn't blame the buyer for investing to "crack the code". But what I understand from this thread is that it is apparently able to be done pretty easy and quickly somehow even right in the store. It still is bewildering to me and I feel like a dummy cuz usually I am pretty good at figuring out techniques like this. I guess these Pack Searchers have gone to school for forensics or something. Dang.

If there is a Topps table at the show, and i think there will be, where will Fred sit?? I am going to bring up the subject and see what they say. More on this after the show!!!

[Playbug]

If there is a Topps table at the show, and i think there will be, where will Fred sit?? I am going to bring up the subject and see what they say. More on this after the show!!!

It would be interesting to see what they say. Please share when you find out.

[Jean Nutty]

If there is a Topps table at the show, and i think there will be, where will Fred sit?? I am going to bring up the subject and see what they say. More on this after the show!!!

Can you explain the situation? Is Fred in trouble with Topps?

[Dr Popper]

Can you explain the situation? Is Fred in trouble with Topps?

I think he referring to trying to find out if Topps is doing anything about the pack searching issue, but Fred is an artist so he wouldn't be involved in that I wouldn't think. 

[paste_anyplace]

Last I heard, Topps Vault will be exhibiting at the show, but Topps didn't plan on having a general table like they have in some years past.

I've never been a Topps employee, only a freelancer; never even visited the office, so I can't speak for them on stuff like pack searching. And I'm only representing my li'l old self at the show. :-)

Fred

If there is a Topps table at the show, and i think there will be, where will Fred sit?? I am going to bring up the subject and see what they say. More on this after the show!!!

I think he referring to trying to find out if Topps is doing anything about the pack searching issue, but Fred is an artist so he wouldn't be involved in that I wouldn't think. 

[lucidjc]

Last I heard, Topps Vault will be exhibiting at the show, but Topps didn't plan on having a general table like they have in some years past.

I've never been a Topps employee, only a freelancer; never even visited the office, so I can't speak for them on stuff like pack searching. And I'm only representing my li'l old self at the show. :-)

Fred

My intentions were to infer you might be found near the Topps table at some point. Not that you would be chained to it.