Wacky Packages Forum
Wacky Packages Discussion => General Wacky Packages Discussion => Topic started by: Joe G. on April 13, 2015, 03:59:40 PM
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I don't know how low Old School 5 will go but I never thought they'd reach $14.99. Did anyone ever order 8 at the sale price and find out whether or not they should ship them as a case?
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I don't know how low Old School 5 will go but I never thought they'd reach $14.99. Did anyone ever order 8 at the sale price and find out whether or not they should ship them as a case?
Truly amazing.
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I don't know how low Old School 5 will go but I never thought they'd reach $14.99. Did anyone ever order 8 at the sale price and find out whether or not they should ship them as a case?
Thanks for posting the latest price drop - $14.99 was too low to pass up. I'll let you know in a few days whether I get a sealed case.
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I take it since they are selling the boxes at 14.99, that there won't be a series 6?
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I take it since they are selling the boxes at 14.99, that there won't be a series 6?
Joe, I had the same thought. It would seem that the classic formula of a great set of cards, puzzle, a cool insert set, some variations and a sketch isn't a hot seller anymore. If we do see a 6, I guess Topps would have to re-imagine it somehow.
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Joe, I had the same thought. It would seem that the classic formula of a great set of cards, puzzle, a cool insert set, some variations and a sketch isn't a hot seller anymore. If we do see a 6, I guess Topps would have to re-imagine it somehow.
Maybe one of the OS Artists could comment and let us know if OS is dead or their is still more to come?
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Maybe one of the OS Artists could comment and let us know if OS is dead or their is still more to come?
well, there's really only one artist to ask, and that would be David Gross who paints the entire base set
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hey guys , it depends on who is putting your order together . in the past when I have ordered from topps ..... I ordered a full case of gpk blasters. I got a sealed case of them . another time I got a box full of blasters all over the place ...... I guess some associates just dont know that if someone asks for 16 blasters that you should just send them a sealed case ....
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hey guys , it depends on who is putting your order together . in the past when I have ordered from topps ..... I ordered a full case of gpk blasters. I got a sealed case of them . another time I got a box full of blasters all over the place ...... I guess some associates just dont know that if someone asks for 16 blasters that you should just send them a sealed case ....
Just for the heck of it, I checked the price of shipping a case vs. shipping 8 boxes. To California. You're much better off ordering a case. The lesson learned is to check various options and compare the postage Topps will charge, prior to ordering.
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Just for the heck of it, I checked the price of shipping a case vs. shipping 8 boxes. To California. You're much better off ordering a case. The lesson learned is to check various options and compare the postage Topps will charge, prior to ordering.
what was the differential? using smart post?
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what was the differential? using smart post?
I believe so. Just odd that there should be any difference at all. 8 boxes is 8 boxes, but I suppose the packing space is more efficiently utilized in the case.
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Joe, I had the same thought. It would seem that the classic formula of a great set of cards, puzzle, a cool insert set, some variations and a sketch isn't a hot seller anymore. If we do see a 6, I guess Topps would have to re-imagine it somehow.
I think it would be a mistake for Topps to assume that this is the case. That is to say, that the Old School format cannot work much as it is.
The problem was when colored sketches started selling for $800. It upturned the apple cart of what Old School was supposed to be. I don't believe it was envisioned as a "sketch lottery" type of set but rather an Old School type of more exclusive, higher-end experience geared toward passionate collectors. But when those sketch prices were being realized, a sketch lottery is what it became. Discussions of the series became all about sketches. Which isn't a bad thing in itself, but I don't think it was healthy for the Old School series long-term. So print runs and expectations were set with that reality as the baseline. And that's dangerous because that isn't a business model that lasts. And it didn't. I think more than anything, that's why Topps is sitting on product that they're now clearing out for $15 a box.
I think the important question Topps needs to ask is this; can the hobby, as it is, support a limited run, direct-to-collector series like Old School without people chasing cases? Are there enough collectors, and how will you need to structure pricing to make it a worthwhile endeavor? Maybe boxes need to be $75-$100 a pop? But you limit the print run to 1,500 boxes, rather than five or six thousand. Of course, at that point, you also need to strip down the "parallel" aspect of it, so that people shouldn't have to spend $500 to get a set.
I'm assuming a whole lot here, but I truly believe that the period when sketches were selling for crazy amounts, that was what brought us to where we are with Old School. Nothing intrinsic to the Old School concept or quality has led to clearance boxes.
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Very well spoken, Jason. Nice to see you posting again. I always like reading your "take" on things.
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I think it would be a mistake for Topps to assume that this is the case. That is to say, that the Old School format cannot work much as it is.
The problem was when colored sketches started selling for $800. It upturned the apple cart of what Old School was supposed to be. I don't believe it was envisioned as a "sketch lottery" type of set but rather an Old School type of more exclusive, higher-end experience geared toward passionate collectors. But when those sketch prices were being realized, a sketch lottery is what it became. Discussions of the series became all about sketches. Which isn't a bad thing in itself, but I don't think it was healthy for the Old School series long-term. So print runs and expectations were set with that reality as the baseline. And that's dangerous because that isn't a business model that lasts. And it didn't. I think more than anything, that's why Topps is sitting on product that they're now clearing out for $15 a box.
I think the important question Topps needs to ask is this; can the hobby, as it is, support a limited run, direct-to-collector series like Old School without people chasing cases? Are there enough collectors, and how will you need to structure pricing to make it a worthwhile endeavor? Maybe boxes need to be $75-$100 a pop? But you limit the print run to 1,500 boxes, rather than five or six thousand. Of course, at that point, you also need to strip down the "parallel" aspect of it, so that people shouldn't have to spend $500 to get a set.
I'm assuming a whole lot here, but I truly believe that the period when sketches were selling for crazy amounts, that was what brought us to where we are with Old School. Nothing intrinsic to the Old School concept or quality has led to clearance boxes.
so....OS6 not reallyyyyy out of scope??? yet?? maybe?? could be?? but sketches killed it all...got it right?? STILL WANT COLORED SKETCHES!! :P :P :P :P :P
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Discussions of the series became all about sketches. Which isn't a bad thing in itself...
A-f'ing-men...and I think it IS a bad thing. This hobby became too much about sketches in general, OLDS, ANS, etc. I think Neil (or whoever it was that initiated the concept of sketch cards with Wackys) had a great idea there, but it was way, Way, WAY over done. Wackys should be about the parodies and the package rendering and gags and all that malarkey. 8)
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Tom, I agree but with new sets we always get some great new parodies and collectors can choose whether or not to chase sketch cards.
WP 2015 comes out in 7 weeks when it does let's try to keep the discussion on the art and gags. So far, I'm digging the work we've seen from Smokin Joe and Dave Gross and can't wait to see what Kirscht and Gambino have in store. Also I was blown away by Pingatore's work in the last set and, of course, Simko is always amazing. I also have a feeling we may be seeing more work from Neil Camera and Fred Wheaton who are two artists that, in my opinion, never get to paint enough. So I'm thinking we have allot to look forward to.
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I think it would be a mistake for Topps to assume that this is the case. That is to say, that the Old School format cannot work much as it is.
I've got an idea for Topps. How about putting 33 un-numbered stickers in a set with a 9-piece checklist-backed puzzle, packaging them in wax packs with two stickers, one checklist, and a stick of bubble gum per pack for about $0.50 (inflation) -- having no back variations, chase sets, sketch inserts or anything else -- except maybe a poster offer on the back of the wax pack for a cheap price that hardly anyone will buy anyway (and maybe that 7 ft. Frankenstein monster and some x-ray glasses too). Then pushing them out for a short production run of about 2-3 months before coming out with a fresh new set.
I know that times have changed, but it worked before!
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I've got an idea for Topps. How about putting 33 un-numbered stickers in a set with a 9-piece checklist-backed puzzle, packaging them in wax packs with two stickers, one checklist, and a stick of bubble gum per pack for about $0.50 (inflation) -- having no back variations, chase sets, sketch inserts or anything else -- except maybe a poster offer on the back of the wax pack for a cheap price that hardly anyone will buy anyway (and maybe that 7 ft. Frankenstein monster and some x-ray glasses too). Then pushing them out for a short production run of about 2-3 months before coming out with a fresh new set.
I know that times have changed, but it worked before!
Of course I love this idea, but I don't think it's possible. The wax pack machines that Topps used for huge runs.. those don't exist anymore and the companies that made them don't exist. It's crazy, but it's been relegated to that past, at least that part of it. [Side note: This happens a LOT in the candy business. I can't tell you how many stories I've heard of things like giant Wacky Wafers getting discontinued, not because of fading sales, but because the machines that made them could no longer be serviced or replaced. This also prevented the return of the original 1970's Marathon bar as a limited edition - the machines that made them in the 1970's no longer exist.]
As for the rest, well, this was the idea of Old School, essentially. But we must admit that that type of series is likely NOT something that will appeal to modern kids and collectors on a mass market stage. At least I think it is highly unlikely.
My theory is that, with fewer buyers of this type of series (like Old School), the product needs to be priced a little more premium-ly (combined with a significantly smaller print run) to make it viable for Topps to produce and for passionate fans to enjoy. I've always looked to the toy business and things like Matty Collector as an example to emulate where possible. I think that's sort of what Old School was intended to be, and I think it did it and still does it well. But the business model got all twisted out of shape, because sketches sold for insane amounts for a time.
I just hope Topps sees that there's still an opportunity for them with Old School. It's a great format to serve a smaller niche market, and one that should be worthwhile for them. I love the series and think it's only gotten better with each iteration. Though I never cared much about the sketches, I did always have fun seeing what the artists created and what collectors pulled from packs or assembled in other ways - many cool things.
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A-f'ing-men...and I think it IS a bad thing. This hobby became too much about sketches in general, OLDS, ANS, etc. I think Neil (or whoever it was that initiated the concept of sketch cards with Wackys) had a great idea there, but it was way, Way, WAY over done. Wackys should be about the parodies and the package rendering and gags and all that malarkey. 8)
It certainly became a bad thing. What I mean to say is, is that what happened with the sketches was not, I believe, by Topps' design. I don't think anyone predicted that Old School sketches would routinely be selling into the multiple hundreds of dollars, when they were found in every $50 box. But once that happened, especially when seeing color sketches hit $800 and $900, it became "the show". But that was a market force driving that and it did lead to it become a bad thing.
AND, when Topps started following that, by increasing print run to meet that demand, a demand that I believe was absolutely predicated on sketches routinely selling for $200+, that's when it started to become a serious problem for the series. Though I still believe that Dave Gross and company did something very smart, the didn't let the core concept falter. The quality of the artwork in the stickers themselves only got better with each series, IMO. So the core didn't suffer artistically, though perhaps it did perceptually, because of a perceived glut of the product.
I just hope they have figured this out and are willing to look at the real market, and accept that market, and give us more Old School.
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Jason, thanks for your in depth analysis of Olds. If I read you right you feel a possible solution would be a limited 1500-2000 box run at $100 box with basically the same format that we've seen to date. Is that roughly correct? If so, I'm curious how many forum members would buy in on that approach and to what extent. For myself, I'd go for it but I couldn't see buying more than a box or two.
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Jason, thanks for your in depth analysis of Olds. If I read you right you feel a possible solution would be a limited 1500-2000 box run at $100 box with basically the same format that we've seen to date. Is that roughly correct? If so, I'm curious how many forum members would buy in on that approach and to what extent. For myself, I'd go for it but I couldn't see buying more than a box or two.
I'd also like it (and probably I'm dreaming) if Topps would do something Mike Jaspersen-like and ask Forum members to collectively come up with our top 20 Wacky characters for a future OLDS series. If the primary customers have input from the start on what they'll be buying, that should help sales, right? Sadly we probably would be prohibited from alcohol or tobacco products from original series 1-16, even though Topps had no problems with including those when it issued Chrome to the general public (which was recommended for ages 6 and above or something like that). Perhaps a suggestion for Colin Walton at Topps?
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If I read you right you feel a possible solution would be a limited 1500-2000 box run at $100 box with basically the same format that we've seen to date. Is that roughly correct? If so, I'm curious how many forum members would buy in on that approach and to what extent. For myself, I'd go for it but I couldn't see buying more than a box or two.
Of course, I was only writing "in jest" when I mentioned to bring back the sets from our childhood. I do think that Topps sometimes overthinks its strategy. Maybe they should keep it simple.
At $100 a box I might buy one and keep it sealed. I'd probably settle into my current ANS strategy -- buy a base set from eBay and the cheap chase sets. I'm not a big fan of back variations, border variations, and chase sets that are rare by intention. I may have deeper pockets now that I'm older, but I'm also wiser and choose to spend my money elsewhere. Seeing how Topps has now lowered the prices on OLDS5 and keeps having special sales on their wall art, I'd find it hard to buy anything that I thought might be discounted later (Topps don't read this, I do want to buy some more wall art -- run it at 75% off, and I'll buy the other pieces). A smaller print run might produce a sellout and then discounting wouldn't happen. However Topps has a history of overprinting which led to every company with a printing press to start making baseball and football cards in the 90s to compete, and beat them, which absolutely crushed that market. I'm still sitting on unopened boxes that aren't worth what I paid for them 20+ years ago. One day, I'll need the space they're occupying, and I'll start giving them away to my Awana kids.
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Definitely a lot of true here to what's happened to Old School (and I believe the other direct sale series). I can't say if there will be an Old School 6. I didn't know there would be an Old School 5 either until I was told to start it so it's certainly a possibility. A few months ago I was already deciphering many of the marketing problems and sent Topps some (IMHO) really good ideas to change things up so it's better for them and also (IMHO) better for the collectors. A few of those things have already been suggested here but I sent in many many more ideas. The thing is, Topps needs to make money. If they don't then no series so I focused on that while making sure it's still the same Old School as before but more stream lined which I think will be better. It's a two way street. Good product/ collectors happy - makes money/ Topps happy. BTW, I know what people want here in this series. I know the market and I know why and what the collectors will buy. I handled all the creative in series 1 and 2 and half in series 3. I had no input other than suggestion for series 4 and 5 (by creative I mean insert ideas, variations, how the sketches would go, etc). I hope I'll be more included again in the decision making for any possible OLDS6.
And another thing. I will say I've never been a huge fan of sketch cards. I will give 100% on them when I draw then but I'm not very interested in them. Not like coming up with gags and painting them. Sketch cards were a fun add in early on but they have a life of their own now. It's the same in GPK and Wacky. It's all about the sketch cards. Each sticker each of the artists makes takes probably 3-7 days in total time from concept to to rough to redraws to color rough to final painting. I do a (B&W) sketch card in 10-15 minutes and I'm essentially just copying a previous piece of work (of course with some extra elements tossed in here and there and always much more for a return card). The stickers and gags are almost an after thought to most people now. They are wrappers within the wrapper for the sketch cards. It's a bummer.
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BTW, I'm not saying this will happen and I have not even suggested it to Topps but I do see that Garbage Pail Kids no longer have the stickers diecut. If Wackys still had the black borders but there was no diecut (the entire rectangle is the sticker) would that be a deal breaker? Some of the GPK people were pissed but the majority just shrugged and moved on to talk about the stickers (well the sketch cards then the stickers). ;D
Dropping the diecut would be a huge money saver and could make the series continuing a better possibility. Just a thought. Your thoughts?
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Dave, thanks so much for addressing this and thanks for working so hard to keep Old School alive! It's always an eye opener to see where the money goes in creating a sticker set. Like, I assume many on the forum, I had no idea that die cutting was a significant cost factor in producing Wackys. That certainly explains why the subsets in WP 2014 weren't die cut. For myself, although I'd hate to see them go, I'd certainly forego the die cut if it helped keep Wackys going. That said, I'd prefer they still had the classic black border (parallel) and not an entire black background around the image even though they lacked the die cut.
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Dropping the diecut would be a huge money saver and could make the series continuing a better possibility. Just a thought. Your thoughts?
I think I'm in the shoulder-shrugger category on this. If it makes a box significantly less expensive, I am definitely for it.
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BTW, I'm not saying this will happen and I have not even suggested it to Topps but I do see that Garbage Pail Kids no longer have the stickers diecut. If Wackys still had the black borders but there was no diecut (the entire rectangle is the sticker) would that be a deal breaker? Some of the GPK people were pissed but the majority just shrugged and moved on to talk about the stickers (well the sketch cards then the stickers). ;D
Dropping the diecut would be a huge money saver and could make the series continuing a better possibility. Just a thought. Your thoughts?
My gut on getting rid of the die-cut is negative. Once you've done that, I'm not sure that it's really a Wacky Packages sticker anymore. That is to say, what makes a Wacky Packages sticker is that shape and how it looks when stuck. And how they overlap with each other when stuck, and so on. In my opinion, that feature is fundamental to making them what they are.
However, if you're at the point that you're removing the die-cut, I feel the assumption must be that these are not being used as stickers by the majority of people and collectors (which is probably very true for Old School). But IF you're getting rid of the die-cut, I feel as if you might as well not make them stickers at all. Just make them cards, while retaining the printed black borders. They'll look great in nine pocket sheets and they'll last longer. And I'm not being facetious when I say that. I wouldn't like them as much as die-cut stickers, but they'd still have some appeal and entertainment value.
I don't stick too many of my Wacky Packages these days, but I have one of the Old School 70's wrapper stickers on one of my Passport portable hard drives. It helps differentiate it from my school of externals. I don't think I'd ever stick a full-square sticker. Wouldn't look attractive and wouldn't really look like a Wacky Packages sticker to me. I guess that's what makes me think that if you're getting rid of the die-cuts, just don't make them stickers anymore. I've stuck a lot of Wacky Packages on things in the last five years. But if they were a rectangle sticker, I don't think I'd stick any of them. (Though I might still collect.)
So, my vote is, if removing the die-cut is what's going to make the difference between making a series or not, just go all the way and make them cards and really save. Wacky Packages Cards.
I would still MUCH rather get die-cut stickers. It would make a big difference in their appeal to me for them to lose that fundamental feature. But I'd rather have something cool than nothing at all.
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My gut on getting rid of the die-cut is negative. Once you've done that, I'm not sure that it's really a Wacky Packages sticker anymore. That is to say, what makes a Wacky Packages sticker is that shape and how it looks when stuck. And how they overlap with each other when stuck, and so on. In my opinion, that feature is fundamental to making them what they are.
I'm not sure I would buy them anymore either without the die cut. I've never been really happy with the various "knock off" sets I've purchased over the years that didn't have them. Even though I never use them as stickers, I don't think I would like them as cards either. I agree that there's just something about the die cut that makes them special. I actually don't even prefer how glossy they are now compared to the 70s, and I don't really like the coupons and puzzles on the backs -- just plain tan or white for me. Maybe I'm just like the old-timer who still prefers to listen to music from vinyl rather than those new fangled CDs, DVDs, and MP3s.
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Here's the front and back of one of my son's school notebooks with a mix of 2014 Wackys, half of which are of the die-cutless variety. Not sure if this adds to the discussion but it was sitting on the kitchen table as I read the last two posts.
(http://s2.postimg.org/5hvm605hx/image.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/5hvm605hx/)
(http://s2.postimg.org/8ng7w7o45/image.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/8ng7w7o45/)
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The die-cut stickers definitely look better to me, and not just because that red and yellow border clashes with the binder.
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Got my boxes today, and they did ship a sealed case. Looks like they're really trying to clear these out - I got an email about the reduced prices today.
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Pat, too cool! I don't think I'll see mine for a while yet as shipping to the West Coast is always super slow. I'm down to just needing a Smokin Joe to complete my run of artists, so please keep me in mind if you end up with an extra one.
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BTW, I'm not saying this will happen and I have not even suggested it to Topps but I do see that Garbage Pail Kids no longer have the stickers diecut. If Wackys still had the black borders but there was no diecut (the entire rectangle is the sticker) would that be a deal breaker? Some of the GPK people were pissed but the majority just shrugged and moved on to talk about the stickers (well the sketch cards then the stickers). ;D
Dropping the diecut would be a huge money saver and could make the series continuing a better possibility. Just a thought. Your thoughts?
I really do want to see the Wacky Old School series continue, but after killing packs yesterday and going through my other stickers, I know that the die-cut around the image really is important to me. I actually peel and stick Wackys, and they're just not going to look right without the die-cut. I've got quite a lot of GPK stickers, original and recent, and I preferred them die-cut, but since I was older when those first came out, I never really stuck them anywhere, so it doesn't matter much to me that the new sets aren't die-cut. Plus, unlike Wackys, the art goes all the way to the border.
That being said, if the only way to continue Wackys is to lose the die-cut, I'll probably give it a try.
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I really do want to see the Wacky Old School series continue, but after killing packs yesterday and going through my other stickers, I know that the die-cut around the image really is important to me. I actually peel and stick Wackys, and they're just not going to look right without the die-cut. I've got quite a lot of GPK stickers, original and recent, and I preferred them die-cut, but since I was older when those first came out, I never really stuck them anywhere, so it doesn't matter much to me that the new sets aren't die-cut. Plus, unlike Wackys, the art goes all the way to the border.
Pat, I couldn't agree more. The die cut (technically, called "kiss cut") HAS to be on the stickers. It's a huge part of the Wacky Packages appeal. Especially, in terms of the old school brand, which is supposed to mirror the look and feel of the originals. If Topps wants to make OS6 and have it be successful, then they need to stick to the formula.
With regards to sketch cards, I know some of you are fans and some aren't. I think they definitely have a place, but it depends on the release. I never saw the practicality of adding them to the old school brand since there were never any chase cards in the original sets, but they fit well with ANS, postcards and wacky comics. When the artists put on their A game, they're as enjoyable, creative and collectible as any other element in the sets. Besides, for some fans, sketch cards are the only chance to own an original piece of art.
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Great discussion, everyone! I love the Old School series and thought
the old formula from the earlier series worked well, why change?
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Pat, I couldn't agree more. The die cut (technically, called "kiss cut") HAS to be on the stickers. It's a huge part of the Wacky Packages appeal. Especially, in terms of the old school brand, which is supposed to mirror the look and feel of the originals. If Topps wants to make OS6 and have it be successful, then they need to stick to the formula.
I agree as well. I was just curious what people would think if the actual cut (not the black border) was missing.
With regards to sketch cards, I know some of you are fans and some aren't. I think they definitely have a place, but it depends on the release. I never saw the practicality of adding them to the old school brand since there were never any chase cards in the original sets, but they fit well with ANS, postcards and wacky comics. When the artists put on their A game, they're as enjoyable, creative and collectible as any other element in the sets. Besides, for some fans, sketch cards are the only chance to own an original piece of art.
Topps didn't add sketch cards to Old School as they were always part of the plan. I had contacted Jay to do them when I was going to self produce the series because at that point Wackys were dead. I thought it would be cool to have everyone get a real piece of Jay Lynch artwork. When I proposed the series to Topps it was just part of the overall design. I think they work great in Old School (especially when the majority were done by Jay and later adding in Bill Griffith and Bhob Stewart) and the Postcard series because they are collector based with small print runs and because all the collectors that are buying these series actually know who the artists actually are and care about the artwork and production stuff and all that other behind the scenes goodness. I think they work terrible in ANS. I have to think the majority of the sketches end up in a 5 year old kids hand who has no idea who any of us are and who doesn't really care about the sketch. Same reason Ludlows make no sense in ANS. ANS should be about the 5-10 crowd for the inserts. Old School and Postcards and the comics are for the old time collectors.
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Dave, very cool, nice to know the origin of Olds. Also, getting some original art by Jay Lynch was the reason I got back into collecting.
It seems that everyone is saying that they love the formula for Olds, don't change anything but we still need to recognize that we're not supporting it enough to keep it going.
Ps. Obviously, no one wants to see the die cut go but if it's a question of losing the die cut or losing Wackys, what can you do. It's kinda like a Zombie bite. Sometimes you gotta lose a limb to keep going.
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I think they work terrible in ANS. I have to think the majority of the sketches end up in a 5 year old kids hand who has no idea who any of us are and who doesn't really care about the sketch. Same reason Ludlows make no sense in ANS. ANS should be about the 5-10 crowd for the inserts. Old School and Postcards and the comics are for the old time collectors.
You're right: the single pack buyers (ie, kids) likely don't care about the extras (such as sketch cards). But it's the hard core collectors (ie, the adults) who are spending hundreds, if not thousands of dollars on cases to get the extras. These are the people that are driving the ANS train...
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Dave, very cool, nice to know the origin of Olds. Also, getting some original art by Jay Lynch was the reason I got back into collecting.
It seems that everyone is saying that they love the formula for Olds, don't change it but we still need to recognize that we're not supporting it enough to keep it going.
I've been spending a lot on Old School since the beginning, partly figuring that it's extra support so they don't stop producing it. But, 10 boxes of Old School 5 with expensive shipping, and then tax on the price and shipping, and then a $20 binder, is apparently no longer enough. And that's considering that they eliminated the cool wax wrappers that came with the early binders.
If Topps had used Star Wreck as the puzzle in Old School 5, I believe many Trek collectors would have wanted that, thus boosting box sales. I put that on Topps as a wasted opportunity.
Of the Old School inserts we've seen so far, I loved the very first 5x7 stickers, and wish they had done the whole set. I also really like the recent die-cut cards. The tattoos were OK, but they don't display well, and I'd rather they drop them and just give us extra base stickers if that would drop the price enough to continue the series.
For the "base" stickers, I can do without the tan backs - my favorites are the white backs, with Ludlows second (although I don't ever again want to deal with camel feet varieties). And, if they want resellers to keep supporting them, they should consider going back to where there are enough puzzle pieces to go with most sets.
Topps has to also realize that they're seriously tapping into the older Wacky collectors' money with their ANS releases with the special collector boxes. If ANS was like it was before, people would have more cash to spend on Old School. When sketches started tanking, they could have used the patches and placks with Old School boxes instead of sketches, and instead of messing with ANS. At least that way, you're linking the material with the older collectors.
Anyway, I feel like I've been doing my best to support Wackys. I'll keep trying, but I really prefer the postcards and Old School sets, and if they want the deeper pockets to keep spending, they might need to reconsider some of their marketing practices. I sincerely hope that they will do this instead of just writing off the brand.
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I've been spending a lot on Old School since the beginning, partly figuring that it's extra support so they don't stop producing it. But, 10 boxes of Old School 5 with expensive shipping, and then tax on the price and shipping, and then a $20 binder, is apparently no longer enough. And that's considering that they eliminated the cool wax wrappers that came with the early binders.
If Topps had used Star Wreck as the puzzle in Old School 5, I believe many Trek collectors would have wanted that, thus boosting box sales. I put that on Topps as a wasted opportunity.
Of the Old School inserts we've seen so far, I loved the very first 5x7 stickers, and wish they had done the whole set. I also really like the recent die-cut cards. The tattoos were OK, but they don't display well, and I'd rather they drop them and just give us extra base stickers if that would drop the price enough to continue the series.
For the "base" stickers, I can do without the tan backs - my favorites are the white backs, with Ludlows second (although I don't ever again want to deal with camel feet varieties). And, if they want resellers to keep supporting them, they should consider going back to where there are enough puzzle pieces to go with most sets.
Topps has to also realize that they're seriously tapping into the older Wacky collectors' money with their ANS releases with the special collector boxes. If ANS was like it was before, people would have more cash to spend on Old School. When sketches started tanking, they could have used the patches and placks with Old School boxes instead of sketches, and instead of messing with ANS. At least that way, you're linking the material with the older collectors.
Anyway, I feel like I've been doing my best to support Wackys. I'll keep trying, but I really prefer the postcards and Old School sets, and if they want the deeper pockets to keep spending, they might need to reconsider some of their marketing practices. I sincerely hope that they will do this instead of just writing off the brand.
Topps should arrange a conference call with 10 "key" Forum members to find out what their customers most want, instead of guessing, or whatever means they are using currently.
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Pat, I think your call about doing patches and placks in Olds instead of sketches is an excellent one. In fact, if they had one full size Wacky Plack (like the ones in the 70s) per 8 boxes of Olds that would have been a chase item that might have gotten a fair amount of fan support.
For myself, I really dug the Tattoos and thought they were a great addition to Olds.
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Cases are now $199.99. Such a deal ;) If there's an OLDS 6 I'll wait for the $14.99 box price. I paid the initial full price and still haven't opened the box. Lesson learned!
I vote to keep the black borders for OLDS series.
I enjoy the one sketch card I get in a box. Not interested in the sketch card madness...
BBG
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Cases are now $199.99. Such a deal ;) If there's an OLDS 6 I'll wait for the $14.99 box price. I paid the initial full price and still haven't opened the box. Lesson learned!
I vote to keep the black borders for OLDS series.
I enjoy the one sketch card I get in a box. Not interested in the sketch card madness...
BBG
Cases are actually $119.99. The $199.99 per Topps' email from late last week was an error. Typical Topps quality control on their communications, post-Jaspersen. If they need an outside, nitpicky reviewer to look at all their communications before they go out, I'll be happy to take the job...
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I vote to keep the black borders for OLDS series.
Don't think it's about the black border. It's whether the stickers are die-cut (kiss cut) or not.
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Clearly everyone here is a WP enthusiast which is why we should realize market saturation might be taking its toll.
Speaking of the line itself rather than a particular segment, I believe many people are frustrated by seeing stock languishing on shelves or not having a viable outlet to get what you want.
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Dropping in from my usual lurking to add my two cents.
I'm of the belief that the OLDS series need to focus more on the adult collector who is just wanting to build a couple of sets but is interested in unique collectibles alongside the sets. This means the wrong idea is parallels, because most collectors really don't care about them in non-sports series. They work for sports cards to an extent, because people collect cards of a favorite player, but they don't work as well for non-sports when it comes to older collectors. Can't speak to younger collectors, though.
What does work are unique items that get the older collector to say that they want more. I look at the 5x7 cards that cam with previous OLDS and those are really cool -- the type of collectible I can pull out and enjoy every time I look at it. I can understand what they tried to do with the tattoos, making them like the ones from the days of the original series, but I don't think they work as well for older collectors these days. A better idea might be to produce posters, similar to those from the days of the originals.
Say, each OLDS box contains three 5x7 cards, one poster and one sketch card. The packs contain the base set stickers, puzzle pieces, and maybe a Wacky-related item that replaces a puzzle piece, but allows collectors to build one set of each (one puzzle piece set, one other-Wacky item set). Sketch cards would be unique and would try to focus on the artists from the original series. There would be nine total 5x7 cards and nine total posters, so older collectors would have some incentive to buy more boxes, but with the idea that they are pursuing a collectible that would hold more appeal to them.
Anyway, the idea for OLDS was supposed to be a set to have greater appeal to those who loved the original series, so make sure the extras you include are ones that an older collector might be interested in, and would encourage those collectors to think about buying multiple boxes. I just don't see strong interest in parallels, so those should be scrapped.
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Clearly everyone here is a WP enthusiast which is why we should realize market saturation might be taking its toll.
Speaking of the line itself rather than a particular segment, I believe many people are frustrated by seeing stock languishing on shelves or not having a viable outlet to get what you want.
Speaking of stock laguishing on shelve; I was in a pretty large Target the other day and they had zero Wakckies, no ANS or Chrome. It was sad not to see the logo anywhere on the card shelf. I lool fforward to seeing ANS hit retail in a few months.
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Say, each OLDS box contains three 5x7 cards, one poster and one sketch card. The packs contain the base set stickers, puzzle pieces, and maybe a Wacky-related item that replaces a puzzle piece, but allows collectors to build one set of each (one puzzle piece set, one other-Wacky item set). Sketch cards would be unique and would try to focus on the artists from the original series. There would be nine total 5x7 cards and nine total posters, so older collectors would have some incentive to buy more boxes, but with the idea that they are pursuing a collectible that would hold more appeal to them.
That's a very interesting perspective.
I think what's missing for me is the thrill of having to save up my allowance, get my parents to take me up to the 7/11 (only place in town that sold them) so I could purchase a few packs -- then opening each one (not caring about ripping the wrapper) to see if I got one I didn't have. Being able to buy an entire case or even one box with the guarantee of getting one complete set removes most of that thrill.
At the same time, having to spend exorbitant amounts of money with a credit card to buy an entire case (or more) to get one of each sketch or a Ludlow-backed set, doesn't work either because I look back at what I SHOULD have done with that money. As an adult, I have real-world problems. Money becomes important because I have to pay bills and prepare for retirement (hopefully earlier than 65), and be responsible, so making me spend more on what really just amounts to some eye-catching stickers and some hand-drawn masterpieces causes a guilt complex. These days, I'm far too busy to open all those packs, package them up and shop them back to eBay to recoup my spending, and that's why I now resort to buying a set from eBay and maybe one box that I keep sealed.
I just don't enjoy them like I did when I was nine years old, but the collector in me keeps me buying the latest set. I seldom really even look at them except when I put them in the plastic sleeves. When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
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The ANS "whatever" series sat on Target shelves because kids aren't buying this product. Those who are interested in the line know when a box or pack looks to be molested and will allow it to gather dust. Who can blame them. Weeks ago my Target had plenty of those bonus packs along with the gravity feed but they were completely gone over so they sat and sat and sat then one day they were all gone. Did someone come and buy them? No way.
What also bothers me is how the Topps website will have a picture of the collector boxes even though they are unavailable through the site. It doesn't take much to piss people off and I doubt that doesn't especially when Target sells other lines with sealed collectors editions on the shelves such as sports cards.
A few simple approaches could work wonders.
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Speaking of stock laguishing on shelve; I was in a pretty large Target the other day and they had zero Wakckies, no ANS or Chrome. It was sad not to see the logo anywhere on the card shelf. I lool fforward to seeing ANS hit retail in a few months.
Andrew, I'm with you. Regardless of the series (ANS, Chrome, erasers et) it's always cool to see the Wacky logo in the wild. We're at 4 1/2 weeks till WP 2015 and I can't wait.
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Andrew, I'm with you. Regardless of the series (ANS, Chrome, erasers et) it's always cool to see the Wacky logo in the wild. We're at 4 1/2 weeks till WP 2015 and I can't wait.
I recall scoring a Coming Soon Shelf Display Insert From a Target a few years back promoting AN7 I think. Maybe they will do that again this time around.
I will keep my eyes open.
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I recall scoring a Coming Soon Shelf Display Insert From a Target a few years back promoting AN7 I think. Maybe they will do that again this time around.
I will keep my eyes open.
Andrew, I remember seeing those and not grabbing one. If they show up I won't make that mistake again.